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V6 TDi to T3 conversion

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mazz View Drop Down
Yardie
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    Posted: 12 Oct 11 at 00:02
So here is the start of our next project, luckily there is no rush on this one
donor car, 2004 A4 2.5  tdi with a whooping great VNT20 and 180bhp standard, but we plan on some tuning

let the strip down commence

car was insurance write off but engine came cheap due to poor running, it was exhausing through inlet, something ive heard many a time before on 1.9 PDs due to worn cams, quick investigation come up with, yep very worn cams, common problem on the 2.5 v6 tdi due to oil speparater not being changed at regular intervals

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote T3ADICT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Oct 11 at 00:45
well they will keep making these newer cam shafts from chocolate..
what gearbox are you going to go for?
WHY T3's.... because they are just so adictive, and having one just aint enough
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mazz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Oct 11 at 07:41
thinking 996, but open to suggestions here, there is  no way a T3 box will deal with the tourqe of this lump thats for sure.
The box in it is a tiptronic !
I think the problem with these newer camshafts is the thickness of lobes, the PD ones are half as thick as a VE pump lobe but run the same follower.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ..lee.. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Oct 11 at 19:31
that is going to kick some arse. bugsy a test drive when its done.Thumbs Up
it`s a big round cage but there`s too many animals in it for my liking.to address this ring lee on 07977 765818.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tram-man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Oct 11 at 20:02
This is not the non PD V6 variant that first appeared in the C5 type A6 is it? Expensive engine to maintain. Audi compensated some owners on camshaft replacement. Can only be solved with the newer cam and rocker assemblies. Check on the interweb as some of the later engine codes were OK. A 2004 would be quite late though and probably be OK. The diesel pump is also a major problem with very limited life. I think they go down with the early 2.0TDI PD engines as extremely under developed engines.

Mazz, can't you document a nice 5 cyl 2.5 tdi conversion for us all? Engine from the C4 A6 or Volvo 850?

Stuart




Edited by tram-man - 12 Oct 11 at 20:05


'97 A4 AFN | '60 T1 ratlook | '57 Oval | Dec '82 T3 Westfalia 1Y+DK+215/60x16
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mazz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Oct 11 at 21:26
Very same Stuart, I look after a few audis with this engine fitted and they have been trouble free, A lot of camshaft wear i have seen on PDs has been caused by poor maintenece, mainly owners not checking there oil, a forgotten art it seems. we serviced a golf recently with oil level light on and drained 2 litres out of it. The cam on my 1.9 PD T5 lasted 200,000miles and my 2004 2.0PD DSG Touran has just clocked up 160,000 trouble free miles.
will get round to a 5cyl TDi one day, there a great lump, there is a Volvo 850 2.5TDi with broken cambelt in my local scrapyard, that calls out to me every time i walk past it :-)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tram-man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Oct 11 at 20:20
I think the 5 cyl diesel is quite underrated. Have you considered flipping a standard Audi 020 5 speed box? You seem to be up for any kinda challenge. I think Matt from Bristol on here has done this. Cut and shut the bellhousing 180 degrees.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mazz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Oct 11 at 21:33
have strongly considererd doing box flip using Audi/Passat box, i like the idea but i would need to trial it strongly on my own vehicle before considering pushing it to customers. The main reaso i have not gone down the 5cyl route is because they fetch such strong money here in the uk, I have been offerered a couple of 2.0 Common rail VAG group engines recently so ithink thats my next step once this V6 is done, apart from all the emmisions crap (which you can now delete from ECU) on the new VW CR engine they seem pretty good.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tram-man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Oct 11 at 18:54
Yep the Audi 5cyl is hard to come by here aswell but the 850's (and some early V70's) are pretty affordable here. Don't the (early) 2 litre TDi's have enormous problems? Something with the oil pump drive or some kinda balancer shaft. Just what I read as I am now searching for a replacement for my daily driver A4 and 5 door A3 with this engine was ticking boxes until a dived into the problems.

How does the 180hp V6 you have differ from the 163hp variants. Is it software or also harware (turbo)?


Edited by tram-man - 14 Oct 11 at 19:00


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max and caddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Oct 11 at 19:52
howdo, the early 2.0 tdis did have an issue with the balencer drive gear but there was a recall and was sorted without any major dramas...injectors however are a current issue and very expensive to sort unless you can get "goodwill" from vw...not easy on a lump from a breakers yard!
 
preety good unit the 2.0 tdi but a modern engine with "can bus" to deal with etc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mazz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 11 at 19:50
im guessing you work in the motor trade too Alex.
with the 2.0pd tdi only the Audi A4/6 suffer oil pump problems it does not apply to the transverse engine i.e the A3 sportback which has a different oil pump, Stuart,  do avoid a 2006/7 2.0 d fitted with siemens injectors, unless they have been replaced as the are very troublesome, all models fitted with bosch injectors are pretty good, they do have there problems but nowhere near as bad as none VW common rail makes and you can have the bosch units reconditioned for £175 each, the siemens you cant, there £480 each from VAG
the 180hp V6 has a bigger vnt20 turbo rather than the VNT17 fitted to the 163
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bayvelle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 11 at 20:32
Ref vw siemens injectors, we have a 57 plate 2.0tdi 170bhp and its one of the engine codes that has the faulty injectors. Heard last week that alot of people have complained to VOSA about the issue of car dying suddenly when injectors fail. Spoke to Vw customer services and car goes in next week to check them, if faulty part numbers then all four will be replaced and loom FOC!
Seems they are pulling their finger out at last, why the fuckers dont do a proper re-call is beyond me as its not if but when they fail.
A late T3 Westy Atlantic and a new T5 work biatch, the perfect world!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tram-man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 11 at 20:35
Thanks Mazz, thats a great tip as I was specifically looking at an early Sportback. Anything else to watch out for?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mazz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 11 at 22:06
Nah there pretty bullit proof, most common faults are caused by steady driving, i.e blocked DPFs and sticking turbo vanes. if you can avoid one fitted with DPF
Cheers for heads up on Injectors, have a none starting 2007 passat coming in monday bound to be injector gone down to ground, ill give VW a call to see what they say
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bayvelle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 11 at 22:39
Originally posted by mazz mazz wrote:



Nah there pretty bullit proof, most common faults are caused by steady driving, i.e blocked DPFs and sticking turbo vanes. if you can avoid one fitted with DPF
Cheers for heads up on Injectors, have a none starting 2007 passat coming in monday bound to be injector gone down to ground, ill give VW a call to see what they say


No worries. Does not matter if car isnt full vw history either, or if its done big miles.
Even reimbursing people who have already paid money out on them. You have to phone them first though and give them shit about Vosa etc etc.
A late T3 Westy Atlantic and a new T5 work biatch, the perfect world!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shaka1976 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Oct 11 at 00:59
Ok I had this engine in an A6 the main problem as you say is the breather gets blocked. You can change it for a later style one, this will solve the puffs of white smoke out the exhaust (commonly mistaken for faulty turbo). These are about 50 quid from Audi, I can find you the part number if you want. The other thing is to disconnect the EGR. I did it by pulling off the vacumn pipe and putting a bolt in the end. You will get a little black smoke for a while as it pulls the oily crap out of the inlet manifold while dries out. I would recommend taking it off and cleaning it for the best results. From what I've read most people found soaking it in Coke overnight gave best results. As for tuning I still have my old VPC tuning box, if you are interested, which gives an extra 30 bhp and more torque, the other bonus was between the VPC and EGR mod it improved my mpg by 15%Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BUS.BOY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 11 at 00:31
Originally posted by tram-man tram-man wrote:

I think the 5 cyl diesel is quite underrated. Have you considered flipping a standard Audi 020 5 speed box? You seem to be up for any kinda challenge. I think Matt from Bristol on here has done this. Cut and shut the bellhousing 180 degrees.
heres the link to my gearbox flip
 
************bristol t3 racers************
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mazz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 11 at 21:37
Hi Bus Boy has there been any problems with your box or has it been all good, and have you sorted gear shift pattern yet. my chioces of box are now narrowed down to flipped Audi/Passat box or 996

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote BUS.BOY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 11 at 21:45
Originally posted by mazz mazz wrote:

Hi Bus Boy has there been any problems with your box or has it been all good, and have you sorted gear shift pattern yet. my chioces of box are now narrowed down to flipped Audi/Passat box or 996

not had time to touch gears yet there still upside down and wrong way round
i have been away for the last 8 weekends 
 i plan to get back on with it in a few week time
when the show season finishes  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hillshy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 11 at 13:23
Originally posted by bayvelle bayvelle wrote:

Ref vw siemens injectors, we have a 57 plate 2.0tdi 170bhp and its one of the engine codes that has the faulty injectors. Heard last week that alot of people have complained to VOSA about the issue of car dying suddenly when injectors fail. Spoke to Vw customer services and car goes in next week to check them, if faulty part numbers then all four will be replaced and loom FOC!
Seems they are pulling their finger out at last, why the fuckers dont do a proper re-call is beyond me as its not if but when they fail.



Sorry I know this post is bit old now, but I just noticed the above comments and about PD170 engines,
I have an 57 60k A3 s-line and it's been a complete bag of dog shit despite AFSH and being well cared for, Iv'e had injectors, short loom, lift pump. totally bill has been well over 2k. they fail exactly as described. one minute your honking down the motorway and next thing you have lost everything, engine, power steering the lot, it's scary stuff, Teflon Audi have been a completed bunch of (unt$ about it all. Misses won't drive the car at all now, so we have opted to sell it and buy another Scoobie. better the devil you know. I know Audi are starting to do something about these problems but IMO unless you get an one with all the stuff done or cheap wouldn't touch it with em with a barge pole.

sorry but needed to vent all that.

@MAZ

loving the tdi v6 install idea,got one in my pisrat mated to the tippy box its lovely. Why not use the tiptronic box with the reverse cogs conversion thingy that goes on the end of the box?


Edited by Hillshy - 29 Dec 11 at 13:29
1990 velle weekender(Hilli) AAZ

B5 Passat V6 TDI Tiptronic
A3 PD170 s-line soon to be sold asap bloody pd engines!
SUKI SJ410 on stilts
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