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2004 2.5 T5 No oil light on dash

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URL: http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=93900
Printed Date: 19 Jun 19 at 13:30
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Topic: 2004 2.5 T5 No oil light on dash
Posted By: GordonC
Subject: 2004 2.5 T5 No oil light on dash
Date Posted: 19 Jan 19 at 14:41
Hi everyone. Just joined so please be gentle!.
My 2004 t5 2.5 has lost its oil warning light (the one that flashes momentarily when you first turn the ign on) not sure if that means if the oil pressure drops the light won't work or not Anyway, I've checked fuses, disconnected battery overnight. Anybody had this before, Hoping its not the sensor. Don't really want to take the front off if it can be avoided. Any help really appreciated. Thanks in advance.



Replies:
Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 19 Jan 19 at 15:58
Welcome. :)It's most likely to be the oil pressure switch.  You can change it without taking the front off but it is a bit fiddle.  http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/topic92445_post715104.html#715104 " rel="nofollow - http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/topic92445_post715104.html#715104  ; The other possibilities are a fault with the dash or a broken wire from the switch.  The cheapest thing to do is just to replace the switch.  




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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 19 Jan 19 at 16:33
Thanks for your reply. I've read your post on doing it, sounds easy enough!!!. The annoying thing is not long ago the front was off and I replaced the gates couplings etc. Bloody annoying but that's life I suppose. Do you you think if I remove the air box there is enough room to remove the connector? .(would like to earth it and see if the light comes on just to confirm its faulty)
Cheers Gordon


Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 19 Jan 19 at 17:25
I don't think you will be able to get at the wire until you take the front and offside engine mountings off and raise the engine up a bit.  Getting the wire off is quite awkward even with all the bits off!  

I wrote a little manual about replacing the freewheels and couplings without taking the front off.  It is possible.  I know it's too late for you now but it starts with taking the vibration damper and front engine mounting off so it might be of some interest to you.   https://www.dropbox.com/s/bk5cfzprdpj8zil/Alternator%20and%20AC%20freewheels%20and%20couplings%202.5%20engines.odt?dl=0 " rel="nofollow - https://www.dropbox.com/s/bk5cfzprdpj8zil/Alternator%20and%20AC%20freewheels%20and%20couplings%202.5%20engines.odt?dl=0  ; Let me know if you have any problems opening it. 

If you have access to VCDS you can get the dash instruments to self-test which would prove the dash LED works at least.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzLAGwMuDIg" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzLAGwMuDIg


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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 19 Jan 19 at 18:04
Thanks for all your info. I haven't got access to vcds unfortunately. I can open your drop box no problem thanks. I will have a look tomorrow depending on weather and see what's what. Thanks again for your time. Cheers Gordon


Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 19 Jan 19 at 21:02
 et us know how it goes.  Thumbs Up

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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 20 Jan 19 at 11:19
Well..... Took the aidbox off, managed to get the connector off without too much trouble. Your probably better than me at this so what's your opinion now. I have Battery voltage at connector, but if I earth it the light doesn't come on!!. Do you think the LED on the dash has had it or should I not be testing it like this? Should I bite the bullet and change the sensor anyway? Any help gratefully received...


Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 20 Jan 19 at 12:31
I'm not sure about that test.  That was always the test years ago with a single wire switch, but because it may be wired via the ECU it may be different.  The dash certainly 'knows' that a warning light is on and can tell you that via diagnostics so maybe the old test isn't valid.  

As a general rule with today's cars it doesn't pay to assume anything!  Having said that, they are usually just a simple 'normally closed' switch.
 
You can check it with a digital multimeter.  With the oil switch wire disconnected and the meter set up for ohms (engine off) put the meter probes between the switch pole and body of the switch and you should see zero ohms (continuity).  With the engine running it should change to infinity (open circuit) which will show up as 1, 1L, or OL (open loop) on the meter.  So whether it is a normally open or normally closed switch you should see a difference as it changes state if the switch is working.


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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 20 Jan 19 at 12:39
Yeah I am definitely old school!! If I can can get the probes in I will try that test. Bit tight though as well you know. Thanks


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 20 Jan 19 at 15:22
I couldn't get the probes in with any certainty so opted to change it. Piece of cake really with your guide. Why the hell you would take the front off for that god only knows. I didn't have to remove the damper. I just undid the 16mm bolts on the front mount and removed the lower section, removed the o/s mount jacked it up and out it came. Just hope that's all it is. Of to Mr Europarts tomorrow £6.00.Cant refit till Wednesday. Thanks for all you help and advice. Couldn't have done without you. Will let you know the outcome. Cheers Gordon


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 23 Jan 19 at 12:53
Switch changed, that didn't work. Still no light. I suppose the next step is finding someone that can test the dash. Deep joy


Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 23 Jan 19 at 16:39
I believe even the very early vans use the CAN system for engine-related dash lights.  Before you take the dash out it's worth getting a full scan of all of the controllers which might show if it's damaged CAN wiring rather than the dash itself.  If you google your town + VCDS there are usually some users of registered versions of VCDS who will help out for beer money. Smile   Make sure to keep a copy and get them to clear the codes and see what comes back in case any are old uncleared codes from the past or someone randomly pulling wires off.

It's well worth getting a copy of a full scan anyway because then you will have the part numbers and codings of all of the individual controllers your van is equipped with (in case you need to replace and re-code any of them) plus any fault codes in those controllers.  It should look like mine here-


Monday,03,September,2018,16:15:10:20365
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 18.2.1.2 (x64)
Data version: 20180518 DS287.1
www.Ross-Tech.com


VIN: WV1ZZZ7HZ4H0****   License Plate:
Mileage: 185760km-115425mi   Repair Order: Scan



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: 7H (7H - VW Transporter/Multivan (2003 > 2010))
Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 0B 0D 15 16 17 18 19 1C 22 2D 37 45 46 47 56
          57 6E 76 77 78 7D
 
VIN: WV1ZZZ7HZ4H057714   Mileage: 185760km-115425miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine        Labels: Redir Fail!
   Part No SW: 070 997 016 D    HW: 028 101 073 3
   Component: R5 2,5L EDC G000SG  7596  
   Revision: 12345678    Serial number: VWZ7Z0C8389072
   Coding: 0001072
   Shop #: WSC 00358 210 88557
   VCID: 1B3123CAD9EA4D9CD2-515A

No fault code found.
Readiness: 0 0 0 X 1 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 7H0-907-37x-ASR-F.lbl
   Part No: 7H0 907 379 E
   Component: ASR FRONT MK25      0103  
   Coding: 0007205
   Shop #: WSC 02756 785 00200
   VCID: 3779DF7A450209FCD6-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC        Labels: Redir Fail!
   Part No: 7H0 820 045 R
   Component: CLIMA/AC            0202  
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 3463E8765474E2E4F3-513C

1 Fault Found:
00819 - High Pressure Sensor (G65) 
            009 - Open or Short to Ground - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect.        Labels:. 7H0-937-049.lbl
   Part No: 7H0 937 049 K
   Component: BORDNETZ SGVER 1.0  1901  
   Coding: 0000583
   Shop #: WSC 02756 785 00200
   VCID: 3A7FC64E7610149429-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 6Q0-909-605-VW5.lbl
   Part No: 1C0 909 605 A
   Component: 3C AIRBAG VW51      0008  
   Coding: 13123
   Shop #: WSC 02756  
   VCID: 224F1E2EAE807C5411-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 7Hx-920-xxx-17.lbl
   Part No: 7H0 920 960 J
   Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRSP VDO V01  
   Coding: 01412
   Shop #: WSC 00000  
   VCID: 3361EB6A017AE5DCEA-513C
   WV1ZZZ7HZ4H057714     VWZ7Z0C8389072

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway        Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.lbl
   Part No: 6N0 909 901 
   Component: Gateway K<->CAN    0001  
   Coding: 00006
   Shop #: WSC 02756  
   VCID: 70EB246630EC9EC4D7-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv.        Labels: 7H0-959-433.lbl
   Part No: 7H0 959 433 
   Component:    Komfortgerát     0004  
   Coding: 00079
   Shop #: WSC 02756  
   VCID: 70EB246630EC9EC4D7-4B18

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 7H2959802
   Component: Tõrsteuer.FS KLO 0202  

   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 7H2959801
   Component: Tõrsteuer.BF KLO 0202  

No fault code found.

End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 06:38)--------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 




 


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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 23 Jan 19 at 16:45
Will do. Pain on the ass. I will do that tonight. Just hoping it's not a trip to the dreaded Mr VW


Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 23 Jan 19 at 21:05
If you want to follow it yourself with a meter it looks like the oil pressure switch (single Black/yellow) wire goes from the switch up to the E-box under the battery joining a red 10 pin plug.  From there it goes to the dash as part of a blue 32 pin plug.  You have to take the battery out and the E-box is below that.

As a first step it's probably worth checking the E-box plugs for any corrosion on the pins first since it's a more straight forward job than taking the dash cluster out. Smile

Be very careful not to short across any pins while testing.           


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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 23 Jan 19 at 21:55
Thank you for your help. I will give that a look and let you know how I get on.
Cheers Gordon


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 26 Jan 19 at 14:55
Without sticking my probes where they shouldn't be the wiring seems to be OK. No corrosion that I can see.Battery disconnected didn't want to risk a short and make matters worse. I have found someone who can make the dash self test with vcds (allegedly!) next week. I have also emailed a local company that repair dash clusters to see if they can help. (I was tempted for a second to stick voltage into the dash cluster, but thought against it) So we shall see what next week brings.


Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 26 Jan 19 at 16:29
Let us know how it goes. Thumbs Up   I'm sure your guy knows but he just needs to select 'Instruments' (17) then 'Output tests' (03) then 'Start'.  If you want to repeat the test you might have to switch the ign off and on again before it allow it.  

Don't forget to get your full scan, he can email it to you as a file.  You can't use the 'Auto Scan' function on vehicles without a full CAN system so he will have to manually select 'Transporter 7H 7J' from the pull down menu.  


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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 26 Jan 19 at 17:40
Thanks for that, I will let him know.


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 11:52
So that was an interesting few days. The self test was done using a Snap-On code reader.(It was free) Everything in the dash worked except for the oil light. I then took the cluster to Cartronix for them to look at. Apparently the cluster has lost its code which makes it unrepairable!. They said the best thing to do was to get a second hand one and get it coded. Not going to do that. Too expensive just for an oil light. I'm thinking of, A-using the sensor and retrofitting an(old fashioned ) oil light on the dash. B-fitting an oil gauge. C-Ignoring it. D-Selling it as a last resort.(reluctant as it's only done 73000 miles) Any thoughts gratefully received and thanks for all your input just need to decide where I go from here. Cheers Gordon


Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 12:18
Not sure what they mean by 'code'.  The only code I know about is the immobilizer code (a 4 digit code on yours).  

That sensor isn't very sophisticated on the earlier vans.  When you look at what VCDS shows as coming from it, it just says 'Oil Pressure'  Range- 'OK' or 'Not OK'.  You could go for something that plugs into to the diagnostic socket plus a screen.  I have no experience of them but there is a current thread here-  https://www.vwt4forum.co.uk/showthread.php?p=6450591#post6450591" rel="nofollow - https://www.vwt4forum.co.uk/showthread.php?p=6450591#post6450591


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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 12:44
I'll have a look at that. Still thinking to conect a light to the sensor and see if that works. With your guide it's only a mornings work.



Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 12:56
Thanks for that will have a look. Still think for the time it would take I might connect an independent light to the sensor.


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 12:59
Thames will have a look. Still think for the time it would take I might connect an independent light to the sensor.


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 13:00
Thanks.(predicted text!!)


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 13:14
Sorry for bombarding you with the same answer a few times. System said I hadn't sent it.....
I've checked that link and had a quick look at it on eBay. Unless I'm mistaken it will only show temp kit oil pressure. I'm thinking whatevers broken would probably stop it reading anyway.


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 14:22
So I wired up a light to the old sensor I removed. Positive to one side of the light the other side of the light to the sensor, using the sensor as an earth and the light doesn't come on. It looks like I will have to get a different sensor to make this work. 😒


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 14:53
I know I must be boring you too death, sorry. At the price I'm going to try this with a light.
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F352212937938" rel="nofollow - https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F352212937938


Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 17:00
That one looks like it's going to be a standard normally closed switch.  Perhaps your original switch (unusually) works the other way and that's why your test didn't work.  Anyway, I can't see why it shouldn't work.  Make sure the threads are identical.  It's a tapered thread in aluminium so don't go mad tightening it, but you have already replaced the original of course so you know that. Smile

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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 17:24
Will do.


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 19:43
I didn't spot the tapered thread (pratt) so well spotted. I've changed it for a straight threaded one now . I've had another word with Cartronix and apparently the Ecu spiked for whatever reason and that's what took that particular part of it out. I am none the wiser to be honest, just an old school mechanic.At least my solution should sort it out. I will let you know. Thanks again for your time. If your ever around Southampton area please let me know and I will def buy you a pint.


Posted By: T5 TDI
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 20:17
You might be ok with a parallel thread if you add a copper washer as long as there is a flat surface for the washer to seal against.  Maybe someone else before you did the damage to the dash before you had the van or perhaps earthing the switch wire did it.  That was always the standard quick test years ago but it's possible that the ECU part of the dash didn't like it.

You might be better to buy an aftermarket oil pressure gauge and sensor.  It would be much more use in the real world.  Basic oil pressure switches only cause the light to come on when the oil pressure drops below 7psi (roughly) so by the time you see it under most conditions it's too late to save the crank bearings.  Sometimes you might be lucky if it just flicks on and off and you are sensible enough to investigate straight away.  Good luck anyway, and let us know how you get on. Smile             


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2004 2.5 174


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 30 Jan 19 at 20:51
Cheers Gordon


Posted By: GordonC
Date Posted: 09 Feb 19 at 16:50
Well here I am again.Last time I hope! Changed the switch, ran a cable from the fuse box through a light. Was looking good on tick over light came on, light went off. Buttoned up the job and went for a road test. At about 15mph a great big STOP OIL PRESSURE came up in the centre of the dash. But I knew because of my light that oil pressure was OK. So I refitted the original switch road tested and all ok. By my reckoning if the oil pressure drops that light will come on. When I change the oil in the next couple of weeks I am going to fit an oil pressure gauge on a t piece so that should be that!!! Still non the wiser why the other oil light doesn't work but ar least it's kinda worked out OK. On the bright side I can change that switch in an hour. 😂 😂 😂 "
Thanks again for your time and I hope I didn't bore you too much Cheers Gordon


Posted By: gregozedobe
Date Posted: 09 Feb 19 at 21:53
Thanks for the update.  Good to know your engine isn't about to self-destruct.

Please come back with another update after you've been running the oil pressure gauge and know for sure what is going on with your oil pressure.



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