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Rear Brake Pressure Regulator/Booster

Printed From: The Brick-yard
Category: LT, Crafter & Sprinter Section
Forum Name: LT, Crafter & Sprinter Tech
Forum Description: All LT, Crafter & Sprinter tech related stuff in here
URL: http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=81142
Printed Date: 19 Jun 19 at 18:56
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Rear Brake Pressure Regulator/Booster
Posted By: volition82
Subject: Rear Brake Pressure Regulator/Booster
Date Posted: 12 Jul 13 at 15:01
From other threads I have read that a few of you have replaced it. I was wondering where you bought it from and how much it cost you?

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper



Replies:
Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 12 Jul 13 at 15:50
Just heard back from vw heritage and its no longer available. Already tried vw uk. I would have thought somebody would be able to rebuild them. Anybody have any ideas on that one?

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 12 Jul 13 at 15:54
Have you tried Euro Car Parts
They recently sourced me an ATE master cylinder from Germany.
I wonder if they can do the same with the "booster"
Actually it's a retarder!
It stops the rears locking up under light loads.


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LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 12 Jul 13 at 16:11
http://www.mecatechnic.com/Default.asp?langue=GB" rel="nofollow - Mecatechnic might be worth a shot, but I suspect, like VW Heritage they get their parts from http://www.vw-classicparts.de/

I've been in contact with classicparts.de previously and they will communicate in English. Very helpful in fact, even going to the trouble of taking a photo of the part to confirm it was the right one for me.

I'd have thought one of the companies who rebuild brake calipers would be able to recondition it if needed. I'm just wondering though, what's to stop you getting one from a more recent van of similar weight, and plumbing that in? Obviously it won't necessarily be a bolt in replacement, but it might be quicker than getting one reconditioned. It might be something I'll have to investigate soon, as mine is a little stiff although the mechanical side is fine.


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Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 12 Jul 13 at 16:14
If my knowledge and recollection are correct the cylinder is the same across the LT range.
It is just the spring that was changed/different - depending on the rated/plated weight of the vehicle.



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LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 12 Jul 13 at 17:01
Unfortunately its a vw only part. Nobody else made them.

I had thought about fitting a later model version. But as stevest said its the setting up of the spring. Had a read through the manual and you need specalist tools to set the correct pressure. Once you have the right spring you adjust it by the sliding bracket. In other words a complete nightmare!

The idea is if i cant get new get one from a breakers and have it re conditioned. Cant be that hard to find somebody. As far as im aware its just a few seals, polish and re spray? Somebody must do all the old classic stuff?

I'll give zee germans a try. Had thought about just taking it out. My vans a motorhome and it must be near full weight. Is that a good idea and would it pass the mot like it?

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 12 Jul 13 at 20:40
I think it would actually be worse removing it on a motorhome, as it reduces the pressure when lightly loaded. So bypassing it would give you full braking effort all the time and make it more likely to lock the wheels up.

But seeing as the load you carry won't vary much, if you had a fixed braking restrictor (or a seized compensator LOL ) that should do the job assuming the restriction was such that it allowed a sufficient braking effort.


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Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 12 Jul 13 at 23:11
Apparently they are still available in Germany.
BUT dont click on this link if you are prone to fits or seizures
http://www.online-teile.com/audi/product_info.php?info=p86102006_281612501a-brkrregler.html
for the bottom line made my eyes water.
I wonder if they are listing it but out of stock


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LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 13 Jul 13 at 13:27
And as a follow-up to my last post here's a pic of the box mine came in
http://www.jam96.com/uploads/Regulatorbox.jpg
Just in case the extra numbers help you source a new one from outside UK
(really confused as to how to use the file manager in the members control panel gave up trying & used our own server)


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LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: BeJay
Date Posted: 13 Jul 13 at 15:45
 


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NIL ILLIGITIMUS CARBORUNDUM


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 13 Jul 13 at 16:33
Thanks BeJay
Any chance you could explain how you did it?


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LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: Canada LT28
Date Posted: 13 Jul 13 at 19:23
Has anyone tried taking it apart and rebuilding it. It can't be that hard.....Big smile


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94 LT28 Doka 2.4D
Slow and built to stay that way
87 T3 soon to be a camper


Posted By: Canada LT28
Date Posted: 13 Jul 13 at 19:38
OK dudes, it seems that RockAuto has them for about $16 CDN

 


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94 LT28 Doka 2.4D
Slow and built to stay that way
87 T3 soon to be a camper


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 13 Jul 13 at 23:47
For the complete unit? If so count me in for one!


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Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: Canada LT28
Date Posted: 14 Jul 13 at 02:21
It is this one?
 
Mine is leaking on the starboard side so i ordered 2 of em.


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94 LT28 Doka 2.4D
Slow and built to stay that way
87 T3 soon to be a camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 14 Jul 13 at 08:04
I looked last night and could not find one on RockAuto, but did find the wheel cylinders as pictured above.






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1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: Canada LT28
Date Posted: 14 Jul 13 at 12:00
AHHH, OK, I thought the cylinder is all that was needed. I thought the booster was for all 4 wheels.


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94 LT28 Doka 2.4D
Slow and built to stay that way
87 T3 soon to be a camper


Posted By: Mike Noc
Date Posted: 14 Jul 13 at 21:57
You can get rear brake cylinders from GSF. New front calipers are available and cheap enough.

I couldn't source a new back axle balance valve, so ended up buying a second hand one from an online scrappy.


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'The Big Slow' LT35 1989 normally aspirated Diesel Horsebox - Gone but not forgotten.


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 15 Jul 13 at 14:52
That is not cheap! I've got a list of 4 companies who re-con calipers so going to give them a try. Plus im waiting on a reply from germany. Once I know more i'll post it.

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 16 Jul 13 at 15:45
Just to let you know that Eurocarparts can get them from Germany in 7/10 days.
S


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LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 16 Jul 13 at 16:43
What sort of price though?


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Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 16 Jul 13 at 16:55
Steve has just emailed the details to me. £245 plus vat. In two minds on what to do. Contacted four companies about rebuilding it. Three said no. One said he might be able to but needs to see it. The cost would be around £80. Been given the details of another company but waiting to hear back. Not sure whats best to be honest. Well i know whats best but £300 is a lot of money!

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 16 Jul 13 at 17:02
My ha-perth worth on the rebuild = have you established whether there is a service kit available?
I have not taken one apart but my guess is that there will be some seals in it which will have to be replaced.
In these situations it's the short cuts that cost more in the end.
that's probably worth less that a ha-penny!


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LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: rowiandasa
Date Posted: 17 Jul 13 at 08:26
Might be worth trying this guy Peter, he also breaks LT's and seems to have lots of parts;
http://www.alfasud-parts.co.uk/catalog/" rel="nofollow - http://www.alfasud-parts.co.uk/catalog/




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1986 LT31 LWB High Top Diamond RV 6cly Diesel





Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 17 Jul 13 at 18:02
I tried the alfa place. He had one for £100 which he said looked like it had been replaced at some point. Plus £30 which was refundable when i returned mine. Which i thought was a bit odd for a scrap yard. Makes me think they can be re-conditioned.

I've bought another second hand one which i'll send off and see if it can be re-conditioned.

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 10:08
This might be a job that I'll have to tackle sooner rather than later Unhappy As I may have mentioned, mine had an advisory on the MOT for being stiff - still moveable but less than it should be. With it being a camper he wasn't too bothered as the weight in it will be fairly constant and there were no problems with actual brake performance.

But I've recently re-piped most of the system after it failed on a flexi hose, and several bleed nipples have snapped off or crumbled to dust, including the one on the regulator. It's a job I'd been putting off for a while due to the state of them - I normally change the fluid every few years but previously I just wasn't in a position to buy new bits if I messed the job up.

Anyway, I've bled most of the system and got an MOT, but there is still air in there. I still need to replace one wheel cylinder as the nipple on that has gone, but if that doesn't cure the sponginess then there must be some trapped in the regulator.

So if I'm taking that off to drill and re-tap, I may as well have a crack at stripping it down. Certainly the fluid in the front calipers was fairly manky, and one was so full of sludge that no fluid escaped even when I completely removed the bleed nipple! Had to poke inside it while under pressure, then got a spurt.

I'd rather have a crack at stripping down a spare though, less pressure on me to get it back together!


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Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 11:09
Thats similar to my reasons for doing the job.
 
I've got something weird going on with my back brakes.  The shoe part of my automatic handbrake/brake adjusters have rusted away.  I have been adjusting them manually when the pedal starts to go soft.  The first few times all was ok.  But the last couple of times I have had to adjust one side a lot more than the other.
 
It could be that the one side is adjusting it's self because the adjuster bar nut is loose enough to move under vibration (wishful thinking I know!).  The more likely cause is air in the system or possibly the regulator.
 
I didn't realise until reading the manual that the correct way to bleed the brakes was the rear cylinders then the regulator.  I've never bled the regulator.  To be completely honest when I replaced the rear wheel cylinders I completely forgot about it.  I've had a look at it and the regulator bleed nipple is more rust than anything else.  I live in the van so I can't risk trying to bleed it and the bloody thing snapping.  Even if I manage to bleed it at some point in the future it's going to cause problems with the mot.  I'd then be in the same position of being off the road for weeks trying to source a replacement.
 
The idea is to have a fully functioning new or re-conditioned unit ready and waiting to install with my new shoes and drums.  The calipers and discs are new so my braking system should then be trouble free for sometime to come.  That is until the master cyclinder or servo goes LOL


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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 12:05
Originally posted by volition82 volition82 wrote:

I've never bled the regulator.  To be completely honest when I replaced the rear wheel cylinders I completely forgot about it.

That's made me feel more optimistic. I was getting quite despondent last night, which is most unlike me. It was just those bloody bleed nipples snapping off as if they were made of cheese! Out of the 7 on the system, only 3 came undone and they took hours of gentle persuasion.

I guess the advice in the manual is covering the possibility that everything could have air in, so bleeding the regulator might not be needed in real life. I think what's happened in my case is that the pipe from the cylinder has drained back when I replaced the flexi hose. The other possibility now I think about it could be perhaps the front calipers, as I was only able to renew the lower nipples. I'm hoping that no air is trapped in the upper part!


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Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 14:16
I replaced the calipers and wheel cylinders at the same time and bled the whole system. I didnt have any real problems. Had to do a second quick bleed after the main one. The pedal went soft. Air must have been stuck and freed its self after driving it.

I havent had my brake pressures checked at a garage so they could well be equal. The van doesnt pull when braking. They certainly were ok when first done and for a long while after so i would say that you should be able to bleed it without touching the regulator.

I would bet your problem is the front calipers. I had to keep alternating between the top and bottom bleed nipples to get the air out. When i re bled them most of the air was in the calipers and i had to keeping switch between top and bottom nipples to clear it all. I would imagine its easy to get air caught in the middle of the caliper which is difficult to push one way or another.

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 17:23
Originally posted by mat_the_cat mat_the_cat wrote:


So if I'm taking that off to drill and re-tap, I may as well have a crack at stripping it down. 

I would not even consider drilling and tapping without it being in bits. There is far to much opportunity for a tiny, tiny piece of swarf to get where it will do the most damage.

?Are the lower bleed nipples on the calipers not just for draining? Admittedly, if the calipers have never been drained you could have decades old fluid in there, just being passed over by the new stuff coming in via the hose and out by the nipple.

Doing mine tomorrow, in the shade, under the van, with my awning out.


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1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 21:19
Glad you got sorted volition82, probably would have been to costly to send from here to U.K. anyway.

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LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 21:45
Originally posted by lorryloader lorryloader wrote:

Glad you got sorted volition82, probably would have been to costly to send from here to U.K. anyway.


Thank you for the offer. I sent you a pm to let know I didn't need it. Just hope it can be re-conditioned now.

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 21:54
Yes got the pm thanks and read the updated post yes we all hope this is possible keep us posted cheers.

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LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 23:01
Originally posted by LTCamper89 LTCamper89 wrote:

?Are the lower bleed nipples on the calipers not just for draining

I think you're right, but I am/was hoping that no air would have got into the top half of the caliper when I changed the hoses. We shall see... Rather annoyingly I sold a brand new genuine VW caliper for £30 a few years ago, as I was desperate for the cash - my wife had lost her job and food/mortgage obviously came above spare parts!

Rightly or wrongly, I had thought any swarf from a drilled out nipple would be flushed out when bleeding (especially if the first spurt is minus nipple), so I wasn't that worried. I may give it a go on the calipers as I've had success once before.

Wheel cylinder should be here by the weekend, so I can replace that and at least completely bleed the rear end. If still no firm pedal then the front calipers have to be the next suspect.


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Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 18 Jul 13 at 23:37
I was on for ages trying to get good feel at the pedal, but it passed the MOT and slowly went soft again. If I pump it once the braking is tremendously improved, so I know it is just a trapped air pocket, somewhere.

I now have a compressor so I do not have to foot pump an innertube up every five minutes.


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1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 23 Jul 13 at 09:43
More shiny parts but no improvement Cry

I've added the details to my blog type thread http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/topic59086_post644998.html#644998" rel="nofollow - (here) rather than take this one off on tangent any more. Although it may be back on topic if I have to tackle the pressure regulator!


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Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 07 Aug 13 at 11:10
Just thought I would post a link to another thread about the pressure regulator to tie the two together for anybody searching in the future.
 
http://brick-yard.co.uk/forum/topic81450_post646648.html#646648" rel="nofollow - http://brick-yard.co.uk/forum/topic81450_post646648.html#646648
 
The following two links provided by LTCamper89 give more information on the regulator including one being stripped down.
 
http://www.lt-forum.de/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=start:reparaturtips:bremskraftregler_instandsetzen" rel="nofollow - - http://www.lt-freunde.de/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&p=61004#p61004
 


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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 01 Sep 13 at 22:00
Well it's bad news.  They can't re-con the pressure regulator.  I've been trying to buy a new one but it seems there are none available anywhere.
 
My vans due for mot the end of October so I'm going to see if I get through this one ok.  I'm lucky my circumstances have changed so I can be without the van for a while.  At a loss on what to do long term though.  I guess I'll have to have a go at re-conditioning it myself via the link LTCamper89 found.
 
I've only had a quick look at it and I found it very hard to follow with the Google translation into English.  I don't suppose anybody on here can speak German or knows anybody who can translate the page for me?  It seems to be a fairly straight forward job if I could fully understand what's going on.  I could do a step by step thread then to make it easier for others.  From the amount of posts about it, it seems to be something most of us will have to do at some point if we are going to keep our vans for any length of time.


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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 01 Sep 13 at 22:19
Did you or any one else try seekpart 24 ?

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LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 01 Sep 13 at 22:36

Aren't they for second hand parts only?  I've bought a spare second hand one but your in the same boat.  You don't know how good it is or how long it will last.  I don't fancy spending just over £300 on a new one but if you could get one it would be the best option.



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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 01 Sep 13 at 22:44
They are all new parts and a German co. Some one else on here was looking for one also and i suggested them, its not showing on there on line shop but they do reply to 'e' mails Good luck hope they can locate and at a reasonable price .

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LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 02 Sep 13 at 21:40
Thanks for that but another dead end.  E-mailed them last night and they responded today with a 'not available' Angry

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 03 Sep 13 at 10:49
I really do hope you get sorted and for all our sakes.

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LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 03 Sep 13 at 13:51
Sorry if its already been mentioned but any one tried mr auto ?

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LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 03 Sep 13 at 15:41
Also have you tried the German LT forum-            ltfreunde.de/forum      i think.

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LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 03 Sep 13 at 18:48
Tried Mister Auto.  They had a brake booster advertised but no picture and the VW part number was the same apart from the last two digits being the wrong way around.  Took a chance and bought it but it was a brake servo.
 
That's a good idea.  I hadn't thought of the German LT Forum.  I'll give that a try later tonight or tomorrow.


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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: woodyrich1965
Date Posted: 03 Sep 13 at 21:47
there is an lt at haynes of challow scrapyard in wantage if any help


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 03 Sep 13 at 22:14
Thanks for that but I'm after a new one or if I have to re-condition the spare I have.

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 04 Sep 13 at 10:41
Originally posted by volition82 volition82 wrote:

Tried Mister Auto.  They had a brake booster advertised but no picture and the VW part number was the same apart from the last two digits being the wrong way around.  Took a chance and bought it but it was a brake servo.
 
That's a good idea.  I hadn't thought of the German LT Forum.  I'll give that a try later tonight or tomorrow.
I looked on there as well (mr auto) and could not figure it and gave up, your brave in ordering i hope you get your money back or is that yet another spare ! i know the story i have a shed full of spares !Best of luck on the German site now that would really wind me up waiting for the page reload and translate ! No broadband where i live ! 


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LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 04 Sep 13 at 20:57
With Mr Auto you can pay a couple of quid extra and you can send it back for free.  Well apart from the money you had to pay up front.  A courier comes round and picks it up.

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: Bohemian
Date Posted: 05 Sep 13 at 18:13
My apologies for creating confusion by starting and continuing a second thread on this Embarrassed

I've still no joy with it.  I'm beginning to worry as I can't get taxed without finding some sort of solution.

Any suggestions gratefully received


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 05 Sep 13 at 19:31
No worries.  There have been a few threads on this subject!
 
The way I see it is we have three options,
 
1) Buy a new one
2) Re-condition the old one 
3) Fit a different pressure regulator
 
Buying a new one looks next to impossible.  Fitting a different one is a possibility.  You can buy them for the new LT's for around £160.  The trouble is you need somebody who knows what they are doing to set it up.  They need to have the right pressure testing gear to set up and possibly change the spring.  I've looked into trying to find a brake specialist near me but I'm struggling on that one. 
 
Re-conditioning one looks to be the best option.  From the thread LTCamper89 found it looks like it's possible but somebody needs to be able to read German.  Or be brave enough to jump in.  I'm being a chicken and waiting to see if my van passes the Mot.  I think it will because as far as I'm aware mines working ok.  I can then forget about it for ten months or so, but that doesn't help you much.


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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: Bohemian
Date Posted: 05 Sep 13 at 19:48
Cheers volition82.. at least I'm clearer where it stands now.. will have to think some more about it


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 05 Sep 13 at 22:47
I had not really looked properly at the link I posted, yes I know very naughty, but it does seem straight forward, though a bit fiddly at certain points, the wire retaing ring for instance. 

I do not speak German but most 'words' can be broken down into ones that can be translated, so I will do the photographs over the weekend, maybe tomorrow given half a chance, and fill in the blanks.

My balance valve seems, allegedly, to be fine, fingers etc crossed, but I am sure it will give up the ghost sooner or later. LTFreunde are also trying to find the same item, so I suppose another 'conflict' is on the horizon over an obsolete VW part.

I sincerely hope that you chaps in urgent need find a suitable cure soon, but I am sure you must all be aware that the last one will go eventually, and if they cannot be rebuilt then replacement with another item is the only way out.


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1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 13 Sep 13 at 19:46
I've been looking into this in a bit more detail, especially fitting a different new regulator.  A new mk2 LT regulator can be bought for £70-90.
 
I thought it would make sense to stick with the same make and model.  They look similar.  From what I can see the only obvious difference is that it has two outputs opposed to our one (from memory we have two inputs?  It's too wet to double check!) and it looks to be the wrong way round.
 
Obviously you would have to modify or make a new mounting plate, convert the single output and set it up.  When I first looked into it I thought setting it up would be difficult.  But on further investigation there doesn't seem to be much to it.  You can buy a brake pressure testing kit for around £100.
 
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/281080565897?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649" rel="nofollow - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/281080565897?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
 
From what I can gather you just screw it into the bleed nipple of the wheel cylinder and you have your reading.  If it's that simple then there isn't much to it.  You adjust the spring, maybe change it for a bigger/smaller one until you get the required reading.  All the readings are in the manual so that's not a problem and you can buy different genuine springs from VW.
 
£90 for the regulator, £100 for the tester, £10-20 for a flaring tool and £20 for a few fittings and pipe.  £230 all in, cheaper than the original!  What does everybody else think, is my thinking sound?  Are there any obvious flaws in my brilliant plan? LOL
 
Thinking about it a bit more it would probably be easier to fit a pressure regulator from another vehicle which is the right way round.  I have a couple of questions I'm hoping somebody might be able to answer,
 
1)  The size of the brake line, is it metric or imperial?
2)  The size of the thread on the bleed nipples of the brake cylinders?
3)  If I fit a different pressure regulator and it's from a car do you think that will make a difference?
4)  If the brake pressure regulator is from a vehicle with rear disc brakes do you think that will make a difference? (If they are on rear disc cars/vans?)
 
I don't think questions 3 and 4 will make a difference.  I would assume that all pressure regulators are basically the same.  Much like rear wheel cylinders or brake caliper's they all work along the same line.  This one,
 
Appears to be the right way round.  It's from a french filth Saxo 96-04.  It looks to be smaller but I can't see that it would make much of a difference.  The size of the pipe doesn't change and it is either open or partly open.  It's just a case of how you set it up, I think?


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 13 Sep 13 at 20:04
Looking into it a bit more something like this might be better as there is room for adjustment on the regulator arm.
 


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 13 Sep 13 at 21:16
Starting to get a bit confused now.  Am I right in thinking that with our regulators the further the arm goes in towards the body of the regulator the more power you get to the rear brakes i.e. pushing the plunger gives more power?
 
On the regulator from the Saxo it has a smaller spring on the regulator it's self.  This spring pulls the plunger in.  This would make me think that on that regulator when the plunger is fully in there is less pressure to the brakes?  Unless the set up of the linkage on the car works the other way round?  All a bit confusing???  I hadn't considered that pushing the plunger in might have different effects with different regulators.  It would just be like the French to do things back to front LOL
 
The regulator above is from a Golf and from a little bit of googling it appears to work the same way round as ours.  Best stick with good old VW me thinks!


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 13 Sep 13 at 22:45
I reckon it's a good idea, and the way we'll have to start thinking in the future. Ideally someone like you will do all the hard work of finding out what works and then we can all copy it LOL
Originally posted by volition82 volition82 wrote:


1)  The size of the brake line, is it metric or imperial?
2)  The size of the thread on the bleed nipples of the brake cylinders?
3)  If I fit a different pressure regulator and it's from a car do you think that will make a difference?
4)  If the brake pressure regulator is from a vehicle with rear disc brakes do you think that will make a difference? (If they are on rear disc cars/vans?)

1) 3/16" pipe, or whatever the metric equivalent is. Pretty standard really. Fittings are M10 x 1 mm.
2) Rear cylinder bleed screw thread (and on the compensator) is M6 x 1 mm.
3) If it's from a car that won't have the same load range between empty and fully loaded, so the compensator may not be able to cope with the extremes. A case of suck it and see I think.
4) Disc brakes need more fluid volume than drums, so the compensator may be designed to allow more fluid to flow when it is at its maximum restriction. I'd try and stick to as similar a set-up as possible just to make life easier.

-------------
Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 14 Sep 13 at 11:10
Cheers for the pipe/nipple sizes Mat. 
 
I'm not living in my van at the moment, I have quite a bit of spare time and my Mot is due shortly.  So, the timing is perfect for me to tackle the job.  If I plan on keeping the van then at some point it will have to be done.  So I guess I'm going to have to get on with it.  I suppose the worse case scenario is it doesn't work and I have to re-fit the old one.
 
The last picture I posted of a regulator is the design I like the look of best.  It seems to be the same one used across a number of VW/Skoda cars to at least 2010.  It also has the extra adjustment on it which is a bonus.  I'm hoping that because it has two ports in and two ports out it should cope alright.  The same design is used on rear drum and disc brakes which is also encouraging. 
I hadn't considered the point you raised in number 3.  I guess I need to get my spare LT regulator back and measure the amount of travel the piston in the regulator has.  Then buy a new regulator and measure the travel in that.  The trouble is a 1mm difference in the travel of the piston will translate into a lot by the time you extend it down the lever.  Really I need to play around with a variety of regulators to find one which works best.  Although looking at the new regulator closely the arm is held on by a nut and thread.  It looks as if you could use washers either side to increase or decrease the lever range.  I'm guessing more range wouldn't be a problem but less would.
 
How does the Mot test on the brakes work?  Do they have a set range of minimum and possibly maximum brake pressure for any vehicle?  Or is it a set range for a specific vehicle?  If it's the latter does anybody know where I would find it? 
 
I've got to Mot another car next week so I'll have a chat with the Mot guy and get his input.  The way I look at it is they aren't really going to know if the regulator is supplying 20% too much/less power.  All they will care about is that it is working and has a minimum brake pressure which is even across the back wheels.  The maximum I can't see as a problem because they are drum brakes and the power will never get close to the front whatever I do.
 
I was reading a thread last night about the regulators on Golf's.  The people who have lowered them have to alter the range of the regulator, basically reduce the power.  If they leave it as standard they have too much power going to the rear brakes and the back can end up swinging out.  Apart from the fact I can't ever see that as a problem on our slower than slow bricks LOL  Those cars must have passed their Mot's like that.
 
 


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 14 Sep 13 at 13:45
If any good to you or you probably have this info ? In one of the latter edition VW owner handbooks in the special information section at the back it gives bar pressure ratings for axle  loads for all MK 1 LT's. Years back when i down rated a 45 to 35 all that was needed was replace the bump stops to smaller one's and adjust the load sensing valve to suit. I changed b/stops and only moved nut position for test to show clean area of old position and moved back after test ! (passed test) Ok this may have not been a smart thing to do ! But this was a strict H.G.V. test and they did not check it in the correct way with a pressure guage @ one of the rear wheel cylinder's bleed nipple as advised by h/book hope this helps get back to me if you need the value's in book.

-------------
LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 14 Sep 13 at 18:50
I'm good on that score thanks.  All the pressure ratings etc are in the Haynes manual which I have.

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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 14 Sep 13 at 20:19
Oh,i also have a Haynes manual and i had not noticed this before. Time to compare !

-------------
LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 15 Sep 13 at 10:54
Hi had a look, the haynes gives the bar pressure in measurement comparison but VW give values for axle load's,ok haynes would seem the easiest method but what if your shocks are worn and weak or say one good and the other 60% worn so your van sitting to one side would this not give you a wrong reading ?

-------------
LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: Canada LT28
Date Posted: 15 Sep 13 at 12:30
Is the problem in getting a new master cylinder? If so, I cross referenced the VW number to a Delphi and found they are available from a number of UK dealers for around 115BP. Or maybe I missed something and rebuilding is desired.Confused. I'm working on cross referencing other parts.

Delphi LM45211

-------------
94 LT28 Doka 2.4D
Slow and built to stay that way
87 T3 soon to be a camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 15 Sep 13 at 14:03
£25

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VOLKSWAGEN-LT-28-50-40-55-BRAKE-MASTER-CYLINDER-LM45211-/260946097044?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item3cc1997394" rel="nofollow - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VOLKSWAGEN-LT-28-50-40-55-BRAKE-MASTER-CYLINDER-LM45211-/260946097044?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item3cc1997394

I got one the week before last, includes the switches too.


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 15 Sep 13 at 14:14
Originally posted by Canada LT28 Canada LT28 wrote:

Is the problem in getting a new master cylinder? If so, I cross referenced the VW number to a Delphi and found they are available from a number of UK dealers for around 115BP. Or maybe I missed something and rebuilding is desired.Confused. I'm working on cross referencing other parts.

Delphi LM45211
 
It's not the master cylinder, it's the brake pressure regulator also called the brake booster on vagcat.  The clues in the thread title Wink
 
Originally posted by LTCamper89 LTCamper89 wrote:

£25

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VOLKSWAGEN-LT-28-50-40-55-BRAKE-MASTER-CYLINDER-LM45211-/260946097044?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item3cc1997394" rel="nofollow - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VOLKSWAGEN-LT-28-50-40-55-BRAKE-MASTER-CYLINDER-LM45211-/260946097044?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item3cc1997394

I got one the week before last, includes the switches too.
 
I bought one the other week after reading your post.  Don't need one and maybe in the future I won't.  But I thought that about the regulator and now can't buy one.  Once bitten and all that.  For the price you can't go wrong.  It's not like it will decrease in value as they get harder to source LOL


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 05 Oct 13 at 17:33
 
 
I've been spending!  I have worked on cars and bikes for just over 25 years but never made a brake pipe.  So I had to buy a flaring tool and pipe bender.  Managed to pick up a NOS pressure regulator for the bargain price of £35.  The part number is 1H0612151C.  It's fitted to a number of different VW's and Seat's.  I didn't know until after I bought this one that some are pressure sensitive and others are load sensitive.  Luckily I bought a load sensitive one.
 
My plan is to measure the position of the regulator arm from a fixed position on the chassis.  Then cut the pipes to release the pressure and measure the travel of the regulator arm from the same point.  I can then work out how far in the travel the regulator is.  For example if the measurement I get is 175mm when connected and the travel measurements are from 100mm to 200mm.  I will then know that the regulator is set at 75%.
 
I'll put the new regulator as near as possible to the original's position and also take measurements of the regulator arm at maximum and minimum.  Then connect it up and bleed it.  After that I will set the spring up so that the arm is in the same percentage of travel position as the original.  If the new regulator has more travel (which I suspect it does) I'll increase the percentage slightly so that it is fully open at approximately the same time as the original.
 
My main concern is the spring rate.  The regulator's are obviously designed to work with a certain size spring.  From looking on Vagcat the size of the spring on the car is a lot smaller than the one on LT's. 
 
I found a thread about lowered Golf's which have regulator's.  When the Golf's are lowered they have to adjust the regulator.  Otherwise the back braking force is too great and the back of the car can swing out under braking on corners etc.  They have altered the regulator by stretching the spring in a jack.  I could try this method if the spring rate is too great.  I don't fancy having to try and fit a smaller spring because the one on the van is quite an odd looking size.  I don't think finding replacement's will be easy.
 
What does everybody think?  Do you think my reasoning is sound or have I missed something blindingly obvious?


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 05 Oct 13 at 19:40
Good luck with all that.

I pushed a relay into position for the indicators today.Ermm


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 05 Oct 13 at 19:49
Originally posted by LTCamper89 LTCamper89 wrote:

Good luck with all that.

I pushed a relay into position for the indicators today.Ermm
 
LOLLOLLOL
 
Been meaning to ask.  I remember you were looking for work a while back and then got a job.  I can't remember what it was (or didn't know)?  Is it going well?


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 05 Oct 13 at 20:28
Thank you for asking, all is well.Thumbs Up

I got a call to return to a place I had left just over seventeen years ago, a while after Littl'un was born. Mainly I am welding , plastic, asbestos removal units. Most are NPU, negative pressure unit, and the rest are water tank type, either for soaking the asbestos or supplying the shower rooms.

It is not for an agile mind, so I do go auto and loose track of time, but there is no pressure, just making boxes out of plastic. I am thoroughly enjoying it, three days a week at my request, overtime when I fancy it, and I offered to cover holidays, which they THANKED ME FOR!!!.


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 05 Oct 13 at 21:11
I remember that you were struggling to find work for a bit.  Good to hear you found some and have the added bonus of enjoying it! 
 
I've found that when your a skilled worker you do tend to be treated better.  The amount of work you want, more if needed (for more toys!) can't be bad.
 
Out of interest when you plastic weld do you use a filler rod or is it done just by heat?


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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 06 Oct 13 at 07:09
Both, and then extrusion too.
Probably a shorter off topic answer would be hard to find, but you did ask.Wink


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 06 Oct 13 at 08:58
I've always wondered how you plastic weld having been a metal welder (mig and mma) myself.  But then I am a nosey bugger LOL

-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 06 Oct 13 at 09:41
I did actually do a longer reply, then the pictures did not show properly so I scrapped it.

YouTube has variuos videos which, if you can tolerate the blather, will give you a good idea of how it works.

http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztQ05wDsqfY" rel="nofollow - http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztQ05wDsqfY  Hot gas.

http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXIiqAxTjTw" rel="nofollow - http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXIiqAxTjTw  Extrusion.




-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 06 Oct 13 at 10:18
LOLLOLLOL The music on the first video.
 
It was interesting though.  I would imagine it's the type of job which is harder than it looks and there's a lot more to it than you first think.  Knowing your settings for different plastics etc.  Thanks for that Thumbs Up


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1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 06 Oct 13 at 11:25
It used to be something different every day, but now it is a little more production line, due simply to the priorities of the company. They are still doing filter fillers of which I did the first, and the jigs appear to have lasted well too.

I put http://s1154.photobucket.com/user/Chris-R-Batey/library/Plastic%20Fabrication?sort=3&page=1" rel="nofollow - these up when I was touting, but I noticed that four of the twelve jobs have CNCd components, the rest were all done by hand. ?Could be a competition?

I keep meaning to get some more on PBucket, it is not until you start looking back that you see what you could/can actually do. Loving making things again.


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 06 Oct 13 at 19:54
Originally posted by LTCamper89 LTCamper89 wrote:

Loving making things again.
 
That's what I liked about the welding and fabricating.  My trouble was working in structural steel, 99% of the jobs were standard buildings.  Once you have made one column and rafter you have made them all.  The tested welding and more complicated or difficult work I enjoyed.  The rest just got on my t**s LOL
 
You have made some impressive things there.  Quite a variety as well, which is good.  Got to ask, why would anybody want a plastic piano? 
 
I replaced the shoes and drums today.  Also checked my pressure regulator was working ok which it was.  Part of me thinks why bother when you have a working one.  But I know I'll regret not doing it and it will fail at the most inconvenient time. 
 
Also worked out where I'm going to cut the pipes etc to make life as easy as possible.  Going to cut the brake pipes on the rear axle after the T piece and back from the regulator where they run under the floor.  Doing it that way they are easy to get to and if things go wrong I can put it back to standard easily.
 
A couple of pictures of the regulator so people can have a better idea of what's going on and being done.
 
 
 
 
 
You can see the adjustment for the spring on the raised bit of the diff which is in the middle setting.  With the adjustment on the new regulator as well hopefully it should be enough and save having to mess around changing or bodging the spring.


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 07 Oct 13 at 06:07
Originally posted by volition82 volition82 wrote:

Originally posted by LTCamper89 LTCamper89 wrote:

Loving making things again.
 
Got to ask, why would anybody want a plastic piano? 
 

A company in Washington restored, and also sold new, pianos and they wanted something to make the industrial unit stand out for customers. 

It was painted gold after we were done.




-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 07 Oct 13 at 08:03
Originally posted by LTCamper89 LTCamper89 wrote:

they wanted something to make the industrial unit stand out for customers. 

It was painted gold after we were done.


 
 
That will do it LOL


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 07 Oct 13 at 17:32
It was also above the canopy over the front door.

Difficult to miss.


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 08 Oct 13 at 17:59
Well I've made a start.  The first thing I did was to measure the travel when connected.  I then cut the pipes and measured the overall travel of the regulator.  There's 10mm of travel in the genuine regulator and mine was at full travel/load.  The new regulator has 15mm of travel.
 
I was concerned that the new regulator might work in a different way i.e. one might pull against the spring and the other push against the spring (if you know what I mean?).  Luckily I have access to a car which has the same type of regulator as the one I bought.  So I could check that they both work the same way.  The more weight you have in the van or car the more tension on the spring.  This in turn pulls the regulator arm nearer the regulator body i.e. pushes the plunger into the body of the regulator.  When you press the brake the fluid pressure pushes the lever arm away from the body i.e. pushes the plunger out from the regulator body.  It took me a little while to get my head around this.  I assumed that pressing the brake would move the plunger the same way as it does when you increase the load.  Maybe that's just my simplistic way of looking at things or perhaps I'm a bit thick?  in the end I gave up trying to work out the logic of it and just took it for what it is.
 
I then set about trying to fit the new regulator in the same position and angle as the old one.  The new regulator lever/arm is shorter.  Typically it wouldn't fit on the bracket for the genuine regulator.  I had to go and get a new bit of plate and extend the original.  I did this by bolting it to the old one.  I then gave it a coat of paint for good measure.  That was enough for me today because I was fed up of lying in puddles of water because it has been raining for most of the day.
 
I'm going to do some more tomorrow and hopefully finish it.  It's just a case of making the brake pipes, bleeding the brakes, adjusting the tension and taking it for a test drive.  While I'm on the subject of bleeding the brakes, I have a question.  Am I right in assuming that the front and rear brakes are on separate systems?  Therefore I only have to bleed the rear brakes?  When I cut the pipes all the brake fluid drained out of the reservoir in the dash.  But I'm assuming that if the brake pedal isn't pushed when it is like this and as long as I fill the reservoir up slowly before pressing the brake pedal the front brakes will remain air free?
 
I'll take some pictures of the work so far tomorrow when it stop's raining.


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 08 Oct 13 at 19:42
The fronts and rears are two separate systems linked at the regulator. I think the routing means you should be good for the bleeding malarkey.

So far so good. Weather down your way is good tomorrow but down to 6*C on Thursday. Better get a wriggle on.


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 09 Oct 13 at 19:30
Well today was a complete waste of time.  I got nowhere.  I made a couple of mistakes with the brake pipes in the planning stage or lack of it!  I got carried away making sure the regulator was the right one and that it would work.  I just thought I've got to extend four brake pipes so I need some pipe, fittings and flaring tools.  What I forgot was the pipes have a flexible joint in them.  The old regulator needed one and the new one needs two.  So, I had to order another flexible brake pipe.
 
Another error was in my choice of flaring kit.  It seems when it comes to buying brake pipe flaring tools, if you buy cheap, you buy twice.  The die wasn't deep enough or big enough.  The grip part of the pipe clamp was made of cheese and completely disappeared after being used a couple of times.  The die also snapped after being used for a bit.  Complete rubbish.  I have bought a Draper 23313 brake flaring tool.  It looks to be reasonable quality and up to the job.  The other one would hardly do copper pipe so there was no way it would do the OEM steel pipes.
 
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-Expert-23313-Hand-Held-Flaring/dp/B008YFX2O4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1381342338&sr=8-1&keywords=draper+23313" rel="nofollow">Product Details
 
The kick in the nuts is when I've looked at the brake pipe angle of the job in more detail I didn't need to cut the original pipes.  The two which come from the T-junction on the axle don't have much room between them.  But I could have bent them 90 degrees and moved it a bit here and there.  I could have then joined them straight to the flexible pipes.  Where I have had to lower the new regulator there is room for a couple of short extensions between the original pipes and the regulator.
 
A couple of pictures of the work so far.
 
 
 
 


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 09 Oct 13 at 20:13
Always something to put paid to a well laid plan.

Instead of buying flexibles you could put a loop or two in the pipe.

Nice choice of underbody coatingThumbs Up ?Factory Approved?

I got these from Frost. Did my replacement cupro fine.
Brake Pipe Flaring Tool SetBrake Pipe and Tube Bender
The flaring tool is a bit cumbersome, but I can use it under the van, which is where most of the work needs doing.

Kee up the good work, and chin up.


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 09 Oct 13 at 20:55
You have got to use flexible pipes because what I forgot is the regulator is fixed to the chassis and the rear brakes are fixed to the axle.  Obvious that the two constantly move because of the suspension when you think about.  I just didn't think about it LOL
 
Funny enough I looked at the tool you bought and it was a close call between the two.
 
Quote Nice choice of underbody coatingThumbs Up ?Factory Approved?
 
You forget how much work you put into something.  I painted all the underside and top of the floor with Hammerite.  Basically if it didn't moved it got painted.  Spent a bloody fortune on the stuff.


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 14 Oct 13 at 20:44
Managed to finish fitting the regulator and make the brake pipes yesterday, led on my back in the rain.  Bloody grim when you have to do that.  I had to space the regulator out from the plate because the hinge for the arm is level with the body of the regulator.  I did this by putting a couple of nuts locked against each other between the regulator and the plate.
 
Today I bled the system and set the spring.  I'm lucky in the fact that my old regulator was at full travel so it makes setting up the new one a lot easier.  I've adjusted the spring so it is nearly at it's weakest setting on the new regulator and this has given full power/regulator travel to the rear brakes ( I slacken it after the first photo was taken).
 
It appears to be ok.  You press the brake and the back wheels lock up and you can see the regulator arm working the way it should.  I have done a very scientific test to check the power is even to both the rear brakes.  I put a piece of wood between the steering wheel and pedal to activate the brakes and tried to turn both wheels by hand LOL  The shoes and drums are new and not fully bedded in so I could just turn them a little bit.  So, I think they are somewhere near even.
 
For those of you that don't know, there is a new Mot test for the brakes.  They have to be even across the axle, well within 30%.  This has been causing problem's because the way the test is carried out.  I'm not 100% clear on the details but I think it's done by when the brakes lock.  Apparently this isn't a true test of the brakes and it can cause problem's.  Say for example one wheel goes through a puddle or you have uneven weight across the axle it will give an uneven reading when there isn't one.  The weight aspect could be a problem for those of us who have motorhome's.  The layout of the interior is likely to cause uneven weight across the axle.  I was reading a post on one forum where a member said they had a 20 stone Mot tester and his failure rate on brake balance across the axle was 99% !!!
 
I can't Mot the van for a couple of week's so I'm going to have to wait to see if it's good enough to pass.  I pleased with the way it's gone so far.  There was a lot which could have gone wrong but it all seems to work the right way.  So, finger's and everything else crossed.
 
A few pictures of the finished job.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: mat_the_cat
Date Posted: 15 Oct 13 at 00:48
Good work! So when will you start marketing a bolt-in kit? LOL


-------------
Mid engined, 6 cylinder, turbocharged 2 seater - it can only be a VW LT!


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 15 Oct 13 at 06:26
Proper good work there.Thumbs Up

You could ask for a brake test. My tester said the new type tests give definitive readings, whereas the two-man old type allow the tester to take into account the load and its' distribution more.


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 15 Oct 13 at 22:20
Awesome job. I wonder how much time you spent on it.

For want of something better to do this evening I put the VW brake regulator part no into google and came up with - hcsale.com. who listed them. Emailed him and got a response in a couple of hours. saying
"Hello Steve,
Yes this part is still available delivery time a few days"
PM me for the contact details. He is based in Holland
And I also come across something cross referencing it with a DAF part! DAF1518097



-------------
LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 16 Oct 13 at 08:08
LOLLOLLOL That's bloody typical!
 
I must have contacted 12-15 different companies via a Google search and elsewhere.  They all came back with not available.  I even ordered a Brake Booster from Mister Auto which didn't have a picture but the part number was the same except the last two numbers were swapped around.  Turned out to be a Servo.  It would be interesting to see if it actually arrives.
 
If mine doesn't pass the Mot like it is, I'll pm you for the detail's.


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 16 Oct 13 at 08:45
"It would be interesting to see if it actually arrives."
Me likewise!
He has accepted me as a Skype contact. If/when he pops up I'll ask him some more direct questions.


-------------
LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 16 Oct 13 at 13:22
Yes great work V82 and well documented good luck with test wonder what cost of new original one is if available after all your hard work !

-------------
LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 16 Oct 13 at 22:28
The price of the original Regulator was over £300, nearer £350 iirc.  If my conversion does work it's worth considering on a cost basis.  The new regulator is £60-80,  an extra flexible pipe, bit of copper pipe and a few fittings.  Under £100 if you have brake flaring tool's.  But saying that if I could have sourced an original I would have bitten said hand off LOL
 
I've been thinking on SteveSt's find today.  I think all the companies I contacted were either in the UK, Germany or sourced part's from Germany (VW Heritage for example).  I wonder if Germany is out of stock but Holland is on a different system like the UK?
 
I'm going to take up LTCamper's suggestion of getting the brakes tested before the Mot.  Should be able to do that in the next couple of day's.  I'll let you know how I get on.
 
On a separate note.  Lorryloader - Did you manage to source your shim's?


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: lorryloader
Date Posted: 17 Oct 13 at 11:06
Good info again but  i would say most of us would not have the ability or facilities to do the job wonder what a garage would charge ? Yes would be good if Holland had other obsolete parts also,yes thank you i have ordered them from vw heritage as reported on another thread there is no phone contact for vw classic so too much is 'lost in translation' !

-------------
LT-45 HIGH TOP + LT-55-BEVERTAIL.Mercedes Atego tilt n slide with lorry loader crane.


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 17 Oct 13 at 11:16
I have just spoken on Skype with the guy in Holland
The gist of the convo being that he is having brake parts made by Bosch in Italy.
I have sent him pics of my old unit which he seemed to think would not be a problem to source.
Is this a lucky find - I hope so.


-------------
LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 17 Oct 13 at 12:06
Asked our local DAF dealer.

-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: SteveSt
Date Posted: 17 Oct 13 at 12:08
and?



-------------
LT31 1991 2.4 TD Florida Westphalia • Honda ST1100 • Ford Tourneo Connect


Posted By: LTCamper89
Date Posted: 17 Oct 13 at 12:59
If there was an 'and' I would not have kept you waiting.

Awaiting a reply SteveSt


-------------
1989 LT28 2.4D    Saviour of 6Music, well one of them. Now playing http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/player/bbc_6music

VW LT Camper not Cramper

....at least the roof is not rusting away....


Posted By: volition82
Date Posted: 21 Oct 13 at 15:55
On Friday I set off to the garage to get the brakes tested.  But I noticed the van was pulling to the right under heavy braking.  Long story, short.  After two day's of crawling around under the van I think I had a partially blocked brake pipe.  I suspect it has been like that for a while because it ties in with not having to adjust the nearside brake shoes as much as the offside (my old shoes had no automatic adjuster).
 
Not long back from the garage and my rear brakes seem to be fine.  The chap at the garage said they gave a good reading.  Slight imbalance, upto 10-15% but he thinks that is probably down to weight distribution.  Good enough to pass though as the maximum is 30%.  I was quite surprised because the van did pull to the offside under heavy braking every now and then.  I think that might be down to weight because the right side of the van is heavier. 
 
Anyway it is good enough to pass that's all I'm worried about.  Mot Friday so I'll keep you updated on the results of that.  Should be ok but I'm always sceptical until I've got that piece of paper in my hand.


-------------
1989 LT35 - 2.4 Lpg/Petrol - Converted To Camper


Posted By: light
Date Posted: 21 Oct 13 at 16:09
Originally posted by volition82 volition82 wrote:

I tried the alfa place. He had one for £100 which he said looked like it had been replaced at some point. Plus £30 which was refundable when i returned mine. Which i thought was a bit odd for a scrap yard. Makes me think they can be re-conditioned.

I've bought another second hand one which i'll send off and see if it can be re-conditioned.
 
If you remove the seals they will have a part number on them and probably a size and manufacturer`s name
 all you need is the size ,if the cylinder is ok you can just source the seals and replace them



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