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Oil: 506.01 v 507.00 once and for all... I hope! |
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willhollin 
Yardie 
Joined: 15 Feb 10 Location: Worcestershire Status: Offline Points: 256 |
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 Posted: 24 Sep 10 at 16:44 |
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I'd be using Fuchs oil rather than the Castrol, it is a far superior oil.
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Liquidfreak
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Joined: 25 Feb 08 Location: Cornwall Status: Offline Points: 839 |
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Posted: 24 Sep 10 at 18:00 |
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IIRC Fuchs oil is OEM with different packaging. It is also what I always use.
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2004 VW T5 Panel Van T30 2.5 130 AXD Engine
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mistadave
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Joined: 13 Jun 09 Location: Portsmouth Status: Offline Points: 511 |
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Posted: 24 Sep 10 at 18:19 |
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Just checked Fuchs website and they still sell 506.01
I confused myself with the oil viscosity ratings, the both the oils have a rating of 30 at running temperature, but the 506.01 is thinner when cold (0W) than the 507 (5W) so it can get to parts of the engine faster when it has just started, which is when most engine wear happens. If the need for the thinner oil on the older engines is to do with the coating on the cylinder bore and its tighter tolerances as mentioned earlier in this thread, then maybe once the engined have bedded in after say 70k they would be ok for 507 because the oil has got more space between the piston and cylinder to squeeze between, and we would then be better off using 507 because its better at reducing wear at normal temperatures. Edit: there is also a document from Fuchs which says not to use its 507 spec oil on pre jan 2006 R5 and v10 engines, but looking at the specs on TPS' quantum oil 507 it doesn't say you can't use it, but just to phone their helpdesk for R5/v10 engines. The funny thing is they do offer a 506.01 oil so i might call them in the morning and see what they say.
Edited by mistadave - 24 Sep 10 at 18:46 |
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55 reg 174 LWB raven blue camper. Celtic remap, pipercross filter, MIJ de-cat and exhaust, Forge intercooler, Allard EGR powerpipe and oil catch tank
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mistadave
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Joined: 13 Jun 09 Location: Portsmouth Status: Offline Points: 511 |
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Posted: 26 Sep 10 at 20:47 |
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I've just dug up my last service invoice from JKM, my local good Vag indy, and they put castrol longlife SLX 3 (507) in it last time anyway, so I may as well do the same this time, although it is too soon to tell if the thicker oil from cold has caused any wear. I'll just make sure i continue to give it time to warm up before using the happy pedal too much.
Out of interest, my oil light has come on about 10k from the last service, roughly how much oil have you lost when the light comes on, and how much is everyone else using when running the 507 oil? before the last service when it was probably on 506.01 the oil light came on at about 5k miles, so the 507 is doing twice as good. I did read that the bigger the difference in the cold and warm viscosity ratings, the more viscosity modifiers are needed which means less base oil stock and so less actual oil to do the job. Also the modifiers tend to burn and form soot far easier, so this ties in with the 507 having better lubricating properties, and also having less soot to make it DPF friendly compared to 506.01. Dave
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55 reg 174 LWB raven blue camper. Celtic remap, pipercross filter, MIJ de-cat and exhaust, Forge intercooler, Allard EGR powerpipe and oil catch tank
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energysolutions
Vanorak 
Joined: 02 Dec 08 Location: Earth (For Now) Status: Offline Points: 3684 |
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Posted: 26 Sep 10 at 20:59 |
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My van (and VW car) NEVER use any oil (and never have)
My mate however has a 104 1.9 T5 and his used oil until 80K, at which point it stopped (rings seating properly I imagine)
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!!Never Eat Yellow Snow!!
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simon bartlett
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Joined: 25 Sep 07 Location: Verwood Dorset Status: Offline Points: 789 |
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Posted: 26 Sep 10 at 21:12 |
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Mine used about 1 litre of oil between services until I reached 45k then not much at all.
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Caravelle 174 SE ( Towing a twin axle Burstner caravan 2000kg (Sorry))
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Happy Yellow
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Joined: 15 Feb 07 Location: Latvia Status: Offline Points: 263 |
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Posted: 27 Sep 10 at 12:15 |
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I think that's correct. The Viscosity Index Improvers (VII) uncoil as the oil temperature rises which is what causes a cold 5w oil to become a working temperature 30w. During usage the VIIs get chopped-up and become less and less effective. That's why a 5w30 will revert to a 5w5 in time.
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2005 Sari Yellow Caravelle 174/AXE 200k miles
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Happy Yellow
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Joined: 15 Feb 07 Location: Latvia Status: Offline Points: 263 |
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Posted: 27 Sep 10 at 12:26 |
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One of the oil companies (Statoil) told me that VW switched from 0w30 to 5w30 in an effort to reduce draining of hydraulic valve-lifters. It makes sense, but I'm not sure it's true.
Edited by Happy Yellow - 27 Sep 10 at 12:27 |
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2005 Sari Yellow Caravelle 174/AXE 200k miles
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Happy Yellow
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Posted: 27 Sep 10 at 12:30 |
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Why is it superior, and how do you know?
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2005 Sari Yellow Caravelle 174/AXE 200k miles
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Happy Yellow
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Posted: 27 Sep 10 at 12:38 |
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My dealer in Latvia has confirmed that they honour warranty claims when 507 00 is used instead of 506 01 in AXE (and the 130) motors. |
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2005 Sari Yellow Caravelle 174/AXE 200k miles
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SicosDave
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Joined: 09 Jan 09 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 94 |
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Posted: 29 Sep 10 at 02:28 |
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I used Fuchs oil in a turbo charged Toyota engine with nitrous. We
double checked readings etc and found with no changes we had picked up 3
to 5 hp. Minor in an engine developing 300kw at wheels, but apart from
no changes but oil change was welcome. Oil did not sludge like Castrol.
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willhollin
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Joined: 15 Feb 10 Location: Worcestershire Status: Offline Points: 256 |
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Posted: 29 Sep 10 at 12:35 |
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A friend of mine had some tests carried out on Castrol and Fuchs oils after they had been in his car ( A very highly tuned BMW 335i 500 BHP +.) His car is over at the Ring very often so is worked hard. I can't remember the exact figures, but the Castrol was providing little protection after it had been run for 6k miles, whilst the Fuchs was still working at near enough the same level as new. I will see if can get the exact details off him.
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Happy Yellow
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Posted: 29 Sep 10 at 14:01 |
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It would be interesting to see some concrete test results. Oil companies buy the additives in from the same firms (such as Lubrizol) - I wonder how much quality is down to the base oil. I don't know enough about it to really understand.
I've always found Castrol to be unhelpful. I also get the impression, from friends who work for Castrol/BP, that it is a poorly run company. It would not be surprising to find that they are producing inferior products.
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2005 Sari Yellow Caravelle 174/AXE 200k miles
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mistadave
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Joined: 13 Jun 09 Location: Portsmouth Status: Offline Points: 511 |
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Posted: 29 Sep 10 at 14:12 |
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They aren't friends that work for BP in the Gulf of Mexico are they by any chance
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55 reg 174 LWB raven blue camper. Celtic remap, pipercross filter, MIJ de-cat and exhaust, Forge intercooler, Allard EGR powerpipe and oil catch tank
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Happy Yellow
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Posted: 29 Sep 10 at 14:16 |
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Err... yes. Why?
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2005 Sari Yellow Caravelle 174/AXE 200k miles
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mistadave
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Joined: 13 Jun 09 Location: Portsmouth Status: Offline Points: 511 |
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Posted: 29 Sep 10 at 14:46 |
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I think anyone from the US would want to slate BP or British petroleum as they incorrectly call it after the oil spill, just don't try and tell them that it was american contractors which caused the disaster!
I don't think what happened over there has anything to do with the castrol product, which i believe is made in europe, however i would be interested also to see some evidence that shows fuchs is better, if the TPS quantum stuff is indeed basically Fuchs, then thats a bonus as its also the cheapest! |
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55 reg 174 LWB raven blue camper. Celtic remap, pipercross filter, MIJ de-cat and exhaust, Forge intercooler, Allard EGR powerpipe and oil catch tank
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Happy Yellow
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Joined: 15 Feb 07 Location: Latvia Status: Offline Points: 263 |
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Posted: 30 Sep 10 at 09:32 |
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Err... sorry mistadave, I forgot to add an emotion!
My opinion of Castrol was formed long before the recent PB problem. It really came to light in 2006 when I was researching oil to use in my T5 - before I purchased it. There was no way I was going to pay £12 per litre (even more now!) for oil if I didn't have to, because I like to change it often.
Their website was rubbish and I could not get any sense out of them - officially or via friends. Just bullshit.
It's typical of British-based firms I'm afraid. I always get better service by contacting European (mainly German) companies - INA (bearings and other internal engine components); Eberspacher; Webasto; VW; Statoil; Neste, the list goes on.
I know, in theory, one oil is the same as the next as long as the spec is the same, but in practice there's too much trust involved in the testing system. I'm not saying that some oil companies deliberately cheat - it's the incompetence that worries me.
When phoning, I'm also fed-up with being put on hold and having to listen to music, which rarely (if ever) happens in Germany. Sorry. I'll stop.
Cheers, Rupert
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2005 Sari Yellow Caravelle 174/AXE 200k miles
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fantasam
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Posted: 30 Sep 10 at 10:20 |
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JCB Van Centre at Ashford are selling 10 litres of Quantum 506.01 for £90 at the moment.
However, they seem desperately keen for me to use 507 in my AXD engine and say that is what they would use if they had a vehicle like mine in for service. DIY servicing is looking increasingly attractive & bollox to the full service history!
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Man of few words, many farts
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SteetonMVP
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Posted: 30 Sep 10 at 14:48 |
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ZGB115QLB005015LTRLL3 main dealer partnumber for 507 oil at £34.04 plus VAT for five litres.
You will need seven and a half liters of oil if you change the filter.
2006 (Nov) T5 130 5 Cyl (BNZ) with DPF and water coolled EGR, 6 speed Auto.
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gregozedobe
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Joined: 22 Dec 06 Location: Canberra, Oz Status: Offline Points: -998266 |
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Posted: 30 Sep 10 at 16:47 |
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I have a simple, non-technical explanation for why VW insist on using 506.01 for the early build R5 (and V10) engines - they can't be bothered doing the testing need to see if 507.00 is OK for an engine they no longer build and that is now "old" and out of warranty.
They know 506.01 is OK and that some other oils weren't good enough, so the easy solution is to just tell everyone they MUST use 506.01 in these engines (which seemed to have earnt a reputation for poor hardening on the cams and followers)
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mistadave wrote: