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Westy battery charger

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    Posted: 06 Dec 10 at 13:51
Has anyone replaced their Westy battery charger? and if so which one have you used.
Does anyone have a wiring drg for the westy one??

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve B Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 10 at 13:58
Gary this subject has been covered quite a few times.

Have a look in Useful Westfalia threads for starters.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Holydiver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 10 at 13:59
Forgot to mention that the charger doesn't seem to be charging the lec batt correctly, it appears to be charging if the main batt needs a top up but once the main batt is fully charge it switches off regardless of the lec batt. is this correct??
I've had the main hook up connected to 3x weeks now and the lec batt is still not fully charged??
Having said that I will check the fuses in the charge next weekend just in case.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Holydiver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 10 at 14:00
Will do

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SebRogers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 10 at 14:32
Originally posted by Holydiver Holydiver wrote:

Forgot to mention that the charger doesn't seem to be charging the lec batt correctly, it appears to be charging if the main batt needs a top up but once the main batt is fully charge it switches off regardless of the lec batt. is this correct??
I've had the main hook up connected to 3x weeks now and the lec batt is still not fully charged??
Having said that I will check the fuses in the charge next weekend just in case.

Sounds like it could be the split charge relay that's not working properly? Worth a look - easier to sort out than the charger. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jp1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 10 at 21:22
If it's the original Westy charger (LG20 - big black box under the rear seat) then it charges both batteries simultaneously, with diodes in each circuit to separate them. So if you main batt is being charged the LG20 is working ok and the only problem can be in the diode or the wiring to the leisure battery.
OTOH your charger may be different from mine ('86 Westy) 'cos the LG20 is all brute force and ignorance, it isn't clever and doesn't switch off when the battery is fully charged..

Here's circuit diagram for the LG20: http://www.westfaliat3.info/WestfaliaBatteryChargerLG20.pdf


If you do choose to replace the charger there are several modern intelligent chargers available which are superior to the LG20. Here's a thread from this site describing a rather elegant replacement.
http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/westy-onboard-charger-replacement_topic40854.html

Some people also like the CTEK chargers.

The original charger is capable of 8 amps or more so you can fire up your Eberspacher heater whilst running on mains. Personally I just use a cheapo 1/2 amps charger from Lidl/Aldi and let it run for a couple of days to top up the batteries (one after the other) during the winter.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Holydiver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Dec 10 at 13:38

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Dec 10 at 09:39
I've replaced mine with a 1210 3yrs ago. Lots of extra room under the seat now.
They are spendy...quality bit of kit. Never worry about charging again!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joker_Club Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 11 at 20:56
Was looking at re-doing the leisure battery charging side of things, and the Sterling battery-to-battery charger stuff looks great (12100 model) , BUT as Flyy says, pretty bloody expensive, it`ll cost you about £400 to do it properly Cry
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Red Westie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jan 11 at 18:32

I'm not really sure why you would want to charge both (Leisure and starter) as long as you carry out the 'famed' interior light/radio wiring mod the starter battery will be completely isolated when on camp. This is how Westfalia should have done the wiring in the first place and gaurantee's the engine will start however much juice has been used whilst camping.

Now finding a single output smart charger (stepped and float charge) around 10amps will be much cheaper...Numax do one for around £60
Martin



Edited by Red Westie - 29 Jan 11 at 18:34
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joker_Club Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jan 11 at 21:22
Yes, you`re right about not really having to charge main and leisure batts from the charger when on hook-up
 
I was talking about getting the leisure battery(s) fully charged from the alty when on the move. Reading up on it, it looks like they won`t ever get a full charge just from the alty due to a lot of electrical trickery and mainly a lower voltage than they need to attain full charge, the Stirling battery-to-battery charger makes the alty work properly at full output when required and give full charging voltage to the leisure batt(s) when on the move, so they get 100% fully charged up, rather than only up to about 75% capacity at best. The Sterling pages are worth a read.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Red Westie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jan 11 at 22:47
Interesting read and sounds very impressive, I would even say useful if you rarely used a mains lead. However, in practice I would say at least 1 in 3 camps we go on have hookup and an opportunity for that illusive 100% charge. 
Of course thats how I use mine so this expensive bit of kit wouldn't bring much benefit to me.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joker_Club Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 11 at 08:39
That`s the conclusion I`ve come to Martin Wink 
 
Just increased the leisure battery sizes to make sure I should be OK without hook-up for a day or two without worry (now got 2 x 90amp batts), also uprated the alty to 90amp, and running a new heavier cable between the main batt and the LBs to try and cut down on voltage drop over the long cable run, with up-rated split-charge relay as well, to try and get a bit more into the LBs from the alty while on the move.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Holydiver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 11 at 13:47
I've decided to stick with the Westy charger as it seems to be working OK now, all I do now is once a week (normally Sunday) I just turn the charger on and leave it charging all day and this seems to be working well.
So if it's not broken don't fix it Smile 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Feb 11 at 17:47
Originally posted by Joker_Club Joker_Club wrote:

Was looking at re-doing the leisure battery charging side of things, and the Sterling battery-to-battery charger stuff looks great (12100 model) , BUT as Flyy says, pretty bloody expensive, it`ll cost you about £400 to do it properly Cry


Charger (Sterling pc1210) cost me £150 my sparky mate fitted it for £20. Some new crimps and tested. Job done.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joker_Club Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Feb 11 at 21:04
Originally posted by flyy flyy wrote:

Originally posted by Joker_Club Joker_Club wrote:

Was looking at re-doing the leisure battery charging side of things, and the Sterling battery-to-battery charger stuff looks great (12100 model) , BUT as Flyy says, pretty bloody expensive, it`ll cost you about £400 to do it properly Cry


Charger (Sterling pc1210) cost me £150 my sparky mate fitted it for £20. Some new crimps and tested. Job done.
 
Sorry Flyy, getting at crossed purposes there Smile I was talking about the Sterling battery-to-battery chargers (400 quid plus), not the hook-up powered 240v to 12v chargers.
 
The leisure batts won`t get a full charge just from the standard alternator while on a run, due to lots of technical reasons, but mainly that the alty won`t put 14.8V into them to get a full charge as the regulator cuts the required voltage down to about 13.8V. That`s where the expensive Sterling batt-to-batt charger comes in, or their electronic alty regulators, which basically take over from the standard regulator to pump more voltage into the batts to attain a full (almost) charge.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Feb 11 at 10:19
Was'nt aware they would'nt get a full charge on the move Joker Club.
Definately spendy to do it properly battery to battery.

Were the 90amp alternators fitted as  standard in the Club jokers and Atlantics?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jason k Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Feb 11 at 12:02
my old 2.1 california had the 90amp alternator
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joker_Club Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Feb 11 at 22:54
My CJ had a 65 amp alty. Even upgrading to a 90amp unit won`t fully charge the batts. it`s all to do with the voltage reg. setting on the alty.
I`ve just bought an advanced regulator from Sterling Power so will report on it once it`s up and running, but expecting a lot more amps into / out of my lesiure batts Smile It`s supposed to make the alty work properly as a battery charger, it bypasses the standard voltage reg. and effectively turns the charging side of things (when the engine is running obviously) into a true four-stage charging system, so getting the batts. up to maximum capacity. Will see how it goes. Major wiring job ahead. Upgrading all the battery charging cables, fuses, split-charge relay etc to cope / get rid of any voltage drop due to long cable runs.


Edited by Joker_Club - 06 Feb 11 at 22:55
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joker_Club Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 11 at 20:51
Done the job now, bit of a mission but managed to sort it. Installed a Sterling Power AR12VD Advanced Regulator, which takes control of the alternator ( it by-passes the original inbuilt regulator) and makes the alty put out enough volts to get the batteries fully charged, then drops to a lower rate to keep them topped up, like a modern 3 stage / 4 stage mains charger does. The Sterling tech. stuff says that to fully charge a 12V lead acid battery you need to put in an initial charge of around 15V (depends on how flat the batt is, and what type it is) and then this reduces once the battery gets near full and the unit changes over to keep the batts topped at full capacity. A standard alty regulator drops the output very quickly to less than 14V as it senses voltage at the alty and not the battery. This lower voltage is the reason that batteries don`t get a full charge, usually about half their true capacity (note that it makes no difference how many amp output the alty is, if you`ve got a 90 amp alty it still won`t charge the batts fully, just half-charge them quicker Confused)
 
 
info on how it works
 
Re-wired all battery charging cables with 160 amp cable, including alty to main battery, main battery to leisure battery (cables run in flexi conduit under the length of the van and into the underside of the battery box, which was the worst job) and also leisure battery link cables (I`ve got two leisure batteries) this is to cope with the expected higher charging current between the alty and the batts. Also fitted a new 100amp split-charge relay to cope with the current. The new regulator senses the charging voltage at the leisure battery(s) and adjusts voltage accordingly, so this gets round the problem of voltage drop over the long cable run between the alty / main battery and the leisure battery ( mine`s a diesel van so starter batt is in the engine bay and LB(s) under the front seat(s), but a similar issue with petrol vans as the alty is miles away from the starter battery which is under the front seat),I`m now seeing a lot more volts at the leisure batteries (started off charging at +15V as batts are low from standing over Winter) so hopefully this will get the batts up to their full charge capacity. Thumbs Up
 
Installation PDF for anyone interested
 
 
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