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Yet another Cooling Problem |
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Pete Westy 
Yardie 
Joined: 16 Aug 07 Location: Under the van Status: Offline Points: 582 |
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 Topic: Yet another Cooling ProblemPosted: 19 May 08 at 16:17 |
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My 1990 1.6 TD JX blew up with failed head gasket some months ago.
Engine turned out to be a total bodge up with half a piston skirt missing amongst other things.
Had it rebuilt with a new head, refurbished bottom half, new pistons, bearings etc.
It now sounds excellent, pulls well but, I think it runs too hot as the temp gauge usually sits above the LED quite a bit. I've now done a couple of thousand miles.
I have an oil temp sender in the sump and gauge on the dash which if I go up hills will soon read up to 120 degrees. Once warmed up it is always above 110.
I've changed the thermostat for genuine VW, fitted new VW header tank cap, flushed out the rad and all the hoses. Replaced the oil cooler. Replaced the rad fan switch with gen VW. Bled and re-bled but it still runs too hot.
I've just fitted temperature indicator spots to the block, head and oil filter.
They change at 104, 110, 116, 121 degree.
To my surprise the block just reaches 104, the lowest indicator spot.
The head doesn't even get up to 104 (which seems OK) BUT the oil filter goes over 110
Is this something I should be worrying about, or is it just a problem of too many gauges?
Anybody any suggestions why the oil temp is so much higher than the head?
Thanks
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dave friday
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Joined: 18 Oct 06 Location: Albox Spain Status: Offline Points: 459 |
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Posted: 20 May 08 at 10:54 |
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Hi Pete, i re-built my engine some months ago too[new head pistons bearings ect same as you!].
On a long steep hill [for 10 mins] the oil temp gets to115-120deg [this is with the radiator fan on the second stage and the water temp needle btween the led and max].
the oil temp is around 90deg ish on the flat [motorway at 60-65 mph].
I think the main reason for the high oil temps is the oil going through the turbo [the turbo gets very hot].
although my air cooled van got up to 120deg c and higher if i pushed it [70-75]
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1992 1.6td syncro
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Pete Westy
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Joined: 16 Aug 07 Location: Under the van Status: Offline Points: 582 |
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Posted: 20 May 08 at 17:27 |
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Thanks dave for a very interesting post.
I assumed that my engine was heating the oil and not thought that the oil might be heating the rest of the engine! Never gave the turbo a thought. I would be happy if my oil temp went down to 90 on the flat but once over 100degrees it stays there, even running downhill.
I suppose my first question to you is 'did your engine require rebuild due to overheating'? and the second to brickies is 'Do you think my turbo may be faulty or do they always get so hot'?
Third question is 'what grade oil are you using'?
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Joker_Club
Vanorak 
Joined: 14 Sep 06 Location: Sunny Lancs Status: Offline Points: 3733 |
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Posted: 20 May 08 at 19:07 |
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Get the large front-mounted oil cooler that Baxter sells and fit that, will get the oil temp down to an acceptable level and improve reliability.
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Sunny Lancs
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dave friday
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Joined: 18 Oct 06 Location: Albox Spain Status: Offline Points: 459 |
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Posted: 21 May 08 at 09:11 |
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Hi Pete, yes the engine did over heat [the auxilary water pump blew apart on the motorway!!!] it might be worth checking that your aux water pump works and the turbo blower//cooler/fan works [if fitted], does the radiator fan come on first and second stage[ mine only comes on second stage on very steep and long hills ,third gear for 10 mins!].
You might sill have air in the system?.
Oil, any good quality 15-40 turbo Diesil rated should be ok [in my experiance].
Nice and sunny here,Barry
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1992 1.6td syncro
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Pete Westy
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Joined: 16 Aug 07 Location: Under the van Status: Offline Points: 582 |
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Posted: 21 May 08 at 19:07 |
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Rad fan works OK aux water pump has been replaced and now works OK.
What turbo blower/cooler fan? Don't seem to have one of those!!!
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dave friday
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Joined: 18 Oct 06 Location: Albox Spain Status: Offline Points: 459 |
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Posted: 21 May 08 at 21:00 |
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I think that the turbo cooler was only fitted to syncros,possibly because the engine has to work harder [in the mud ect] and its heavier.Before the rebuild the oil light used to come on at tickover[when really hot], it doesent now[ i replaced the oil pump and piston cooling oil jets] .It might be that the engine is not fully run in?.I would an oil and filter change,check the valve clearnces,injector pump and valve timing and maybe have the injectors checked.
Good luck.
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1992 1.6td syncro
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ElTel
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Joined: 07 May 08 Location: Sheffield Status: Offline Points: 52 |
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Posted: 28 May 08 at 20:34 |
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Hi all
Having peoblems with aux water pump, which is constant live. can you tell me where the sensor is?
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Growing Old is compulsory
Growing up is only a option |
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mrhutch
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the ginger princess Joined: 21 Aug 07 Location: Herefordshire Status: Offline Points: 5147 |
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Posted: 02 Jun 08 at 14:43 |
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I am assured that the sensor you need is the one on the water pipe that exits the block on the side just under the injectors. It is a grey sender, about £15 from VW (I'm waiting for one now!)
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Pete Westy
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Joined: 16 Aug 07 Location: Under the van Status: Offline Points: 582 |
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Posted: 02 Jun 08 at 15:17 |
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I had the same problem with this sensor failing. I believe that the three sensors in this area are all the same part number
Easiest is to just take the plugs of until the pump stops running.
If you are changing the two pin sensors order new o-rings and clips. They are easier to get out if you leave the plug clipped on and then pull them out with the plug (not the wires!) Edited by Pete Westy - 02 Jun 08 at 15:19 |
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mrhutch
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the ginger princess Joined: 21 Aug 07 Location: Herefordshire Status: Offline Points: 5147 |
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Posted: 02 Jun 08 at 15:23 |
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Ahhh, I was told by friendly VW parts man that this sensor is NOT the same (I have a box of sensors
 )be interesting to find out, I'll post back when I go to pick up the jobbie |
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dave friday
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Joined: 18 Oct 06 Location: Albox Spain Status: Offline Points: 459 |
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Posted: 02 Jun 08 at 21:13 |
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Two of the sensors resistance alter with temperature [but on mine have differant connectors] the third is a switch [for the aux water pump] that should come on when the water temperature gets to 107 deg c .The part number [on mine] is 251919369f.
Good luck.
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1992 1.6td syncro
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Chappy
Vanorak
Arriba! Yii-hah! Joined: 08 Jul 07 Location: North O'Cardiff Status: Offline Points: 5085 |
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Posted: 02 Jun 08 at 21:16 |
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I don't think it's a sender as such - it's a temp switch. 104 deg I think?
Sorry Pete - we hijacked your thread...
 How's it going with the cooling diagnostics??
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Back in the slow lane, yeah!
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Chappy
Vanorak
Arriba! Yii-hah! Joined: 08 Jul 07 Location: North O'Cardiff Status: Offline Points: 5085 |
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Posted: 02 Jun 08 at 21:22 |
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Damn! Beat me to it Dave
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Back in the slow lane, yeah!
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Pete Westy
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Joined: 16 Aug 07 Location: Under the van Status: Offline Points: 582 |
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Posted: 03 Jun 08 at 13:47 |
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Absolutely right. Part number on mine is also 251 919 369f for the switch
Part number for the two sensors is 251 919 5010
All these are two pin connectors on mine. I think some have only one.
Sorry for the misinfo Edited by Pete Westy - 03 Jun 08 at 13:48 |
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Pete Westy
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Posted: 10 Jun 08 at 21:01 |
Cooling Problem apparently solved
Thanks to Chappie for a lot of support, dave friday for pointing me in the direction of hot oil and Joker_Club for telling me to get a front mounted oil cooler.
Thanks to Simon for telling me how to fit it.
I plumbed it in yesterday really simple to fit.
Today I took the van for a run. Air temperture 25 degree. Hot. Water temp sitting just above the LED - perfect. Then went for its standard overheating test run up a 2 mile 1:6 hill, foot on the floor at 4000 rpm all the way. Couldn't get the oil temp to get above 90. Water temp still sitting just above the LED (prior to fitting the cooler I would have to back off as the oil temp threatened to go over 120)
Cool air coming out the vents with the heater turned off, it was always hot before.
The oil pressure has also gone up by about 0.5 bar
Vehicle is transformed.
Hopefully I've given this product so much praise Simon will give me some discount next time Edited by Pete Westy - 10 Jun 08 at 21:03 |
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Chappy
Vanorak
Arriba! Yii-hah! Joined: 08 Jul 07 Location: North O'Cardiff Status: Offline Points: 5085 |
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Posted: 10 Jun 08 at 21:08 |
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Woooohooooo!!Nice one Pete! Top result!
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Back in the slow lane, yeah!
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mrhutch
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the ginger princess Joined: 21 Aug 07 Location: Herefordshire Status: Offline Points: 5147 |
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Posted: 10 Jun 08 at 21:21 |
 I've got mine ready to fit now |
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Chappy
Vanorak
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Posted: 10 Jun 08 at 21:34 |
if everyone else has got one, I want one too! where from??
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Back in the slow lane, yeah!
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mrhutch
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the ginger princess Joined: 21 Aug 07 Location: Herefordshire Status: Offline Points: 5147 |
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Posted: 11 Jun 08 at 00:07 |
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OK.... here's my story..
Same symptoms as Pete and Dave (see posts 1 and 2). My JX blew up and now I am running a 1Y block and head, AAZ injectors and pump, and JX turbo and manifolds. Really happy with the result, apart from I (like the aforementioned) seem to hit thermal efficiency at 60mph (standard issue JX gearbox) If I go 65-70 on the flat on motorway the temperature gauge creeps up to between the LED and max, then I panic and slow down to 50, turn on the heater and swear. The engine will hold 70mph alright but I can't stand to let it get that hot.. having driven the JX into the ground I'm paranoid about overheating this hybrid lump! So I called Sir Baxter who was great and informed me of the supplier for the oil cooler sandwich plate... I honestly couldn't afford Simons' kit.. If I could, I'd have bought it, believe me!!. I'll blame the credit crunch but no self-employed person seems to have any clients these days who want to spend a great deal  .So, sourced a sandwich plate, and some mocal oil hosing, then won an oxford cooler on Ebay.. and started fabricating tonight after being gee'd on by Pete's post at 21.01 bear in mind I'm not a professional welder ~ I'm not even proficient! and I think the cooler may bit a tad on the small side... here's where I am! During... remembered I should take some pics.. See cooler in lower grill..  *waits for the backlash from the pros  *Fabricate your own "L" brackets  Line everything up  weld baby weld..  And thats where I'm at.. desperately trying to reach the goal of cruising at 70 without overheating.. really glad you got sorted Pete... um, do you think mine is too small   Edited by mrhutch - 11 Jun 08 at 10:38 |
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mrhutch wrote: