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AHU wild camper panelvan!

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Bennythew View Drop Down
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    Posted: 11 Jan 16 at 00:36
-EDIT-
Initially I was looking at a simple AAZ swap option but subsequently decided to go tdi and carry out some other work on the van while I'm at it. I've kept this as my build thread but the first few posts are from when I had other plans.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I've been doing all the usual pre swap research on engine choices an decided to go AAZ.

Less gearing issues, still a marked increase from my Ky, perfect.
Only issue is finding one has become quite the challenge.

Most are high mileage, overpriced or without ancillaries.

I've been on some polo forums and some French vw forums (I speak the lingo) and all the info seems to say that you can turbo the AEF engine.

It has piston sqirters and the internals will take it. Apparently it's been done using golf gtd injectors , I-pump and Passat manifolds, Then what ever turbo suits.

I think people have had 130bhp out of similar setups but I wouldn't be aiming that high; just the 90/100bhp mark.

Now I'm new to T3's and diesels in general. I'm more comfortable fixing helicopters and pissing about with aircooled stuff.

Am I missing something or could this be a good option for those not wanting the gearing issues of a tdi but struggling to find an AAZ?



Edited by Bennythew - 21 Jan 16 at 11:00
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote mrhutch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 16 at 08:06
i've done similar years ago using a 1Y with JX ancilliaries

Worked well
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scimdiesel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 16 at 22:30
In my experience the aaz was over rated!. Don't get me wrong mine gave me no trouble but... If you fit an oily temp gauge you'll crap your self than buy a front mounted oil cooler the week later. And as said really hard to by a good one.   Paying 750 notes for a 23 year old motor guarantees nothing. And although they produce there power higher up the Rev range than say a 1.9 tdi 1z or ahu, it's still less and feel under geared.   I'd recommend going for a standard 90 Bhp tdi.   The physical fitting is just like fitting a aaz.   Clock the turbo, make an exhaust, and you don't need to put a bulge in the inspection hatch to clear the Lda.    Yes there is a ecu to deal with but syncroandy on here can sort the loom to be no more than a few wires to connect.    People talk about the need for gearing changes which is the icing on the cake.    But!   I drove my tdi about for a while with stock petrol 5 speed gearbox and it was far quieter, smoother, quicker than the aaz ever was.
Without engineers science is just philosophy..... Joined the revolution with a 18 year old TDI :
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote timmythedog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 16 at 08:22
If you speak a little french, go on to www.leboncoin.fr  I have seen quite a number of AAZ`s over the last few months, often decent mileage, and usually 250-400 euros range. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote GavB95 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 16 at 09:18
Keep an eye out for complete cars, I picked up an AAZ engined mk3 golf GL with 90,000 and good history for £400.

I've just had a quick look on auto trader and there's an 80,000 mile Mk3 TDI in Kent for £490 that looks like it could be a good donor.

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/services/car-dealers/uk/south-east/kent/west-malling/jj-autos-west-malling-dpp-10000691/sort/default
Bluestar T3 running AAZ/flipped box
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bennythew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 16 at 15:24
Wouldn't that be a 1z tdi?

The elctronics don't concern me too much. I've just read time and time again that tdi=re-gear.

I need to get my hands on a vanagon Bentley and see how in depth the gearbox section is.

If a basic tdi setup would be drivable with my DW box and 27.5 inch wheels than I'd go for that.


But...

I could do a box rebuild myself, if I can get the right guidance material.
Ive stripped aircraft gearboxes and have a full cryogenic set up at work.

I love my panel but struggle to justify spending more than the total value of it on an engine swap.

I need to be able to do it myself.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bennythew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 16 at 16:13


With the AT tyres I'd like to fit the ratios don't look all that bad..

Opinions?











Edited by Bennythew - 13 Jan 16 at 16:20
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GavB95 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 16 at 16:35
Originally posted by Bennythew Bennythew wrote:

Wouldn't that be a 1z tdi?

The elctronics don't concern me too much. I've just read time and time again that tdi=re-gear.

I need to get my hands on a vanagon Bentley and see how in depth the gearbox section is.

If a basic tdi setup would be drivable with my DW box and 27.5 inch wheels than I'd go for that.


But...

I could do a box rebuild myself, if I can get the right guidance material.
Ive stripped aircraft gearboxes and have a full cryogenic set up at work.

I love my panel but struggle to justify spending more than the total value of it on an engine swap.

I need to be able to do it myself.

Yes, that should be a 1Z in the Golf, so should be 90bhp out of the box with no messing. Have a look here for a breakdown of gear ratios:


The DW looks like a good box. 

x
Code:

No of Gears:

Gearbox Usage:

Gear Ratios:

RPM @ mph in top gear with
185/80 R14 tyres (651mm dia):

Syn-
cro?

Disp.:(litres)

Fuel:

Power:(BHP)

Date:

G

1

2

3

4

5

R

Final
Drive:

50

60

70

80

DW

N

 

P

78

-11.83

-

4,11

2.33

1.48

1.02

0.78

 

4.86

2488

2985

3483

3980



Edited by GavB95 - 13 Jan 16 at 16:56
Bluestar T3 running AAZ/flipped box
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bennythew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 16 at 17:04
I'll call about the golf tomorrow, It's only 100 miles from me.

So... If I go this way... Shopping list?

-Fabricate an exhaust to fit using the golf manifold and my stock backbox.

-JX sump, ether new or recon (or weld a boss onto my Ky sump)

-Air intake? Reading required on this one. I'm assuming the golf inlet manifold is usable or will I need a JX intake?

-Wiring. Ether reloom it myself or pay someone to. Would the above car be immobilised via the Ecu? If so, how do you get around it?

-Mounting, only one mount to fab/buy if I'm correct?

-inter cooling and oil cooler to be researched.


Anything else?

Edited by Bennythew - 13 Jan 16 at 17:06
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DRawl21 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 16 at 17:49
i'd like to go this route too, but always thought a TDI installation was difficult and costly?,mine's a 1.6d cs crewcab,hope you get sorted,i'll be keeping an eye on this thread,cheers Dave
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GavB95 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 16 at 16:29
There's a lot of good info on 1Z conversions, here's a bit of a guide from over on club 80 90:


Adapter plates for the turbo (to allow use of the JX exhaust and manifold are available from Ultimate engineering if you can't fabricate your own. They do other TDI conversion parts too e.g mounts, throttle pot brackets etc


You can get adapter blocks for the sump to convert to TD spec:


Try doing as much as you can as the costs can rack up pretty quickly!



Edited by GavB95 - 14 Jan 16 at 16:44
Bluestar T3 running AAZ/flipped box
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote timmythedog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 16 at 17:33
I think that gearing is too low for a tdi. Perfectly suited to an AAZ.You`re not far off Benny, but maybe if you could nudge those tyres up a bit, perhaps 225`s.  I think you want maximum 3000rpm at 70mph. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bennythew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 16 at 18:12
Right then...

Things are moving. I enquired about the suggested golf and this is what came of it.

It was a golf courtesy car with yearly services up to 51k, it was then bought by a dealer who used it as a hack to the current 80k. Pulls like a train, Ahu engine code, bodywork is good (not that it's my concern but it's good that it's not a dog) and yeah... It sounds good.

So fuck it. I bought it. Pick it up on Tuesday.

So this is officially turning into a build thread, the title will be changed accordingly.

Timmythedog- as I'm going for a 2wd wild camper I'm not afraid of putting bigger rubber on. I plan to put the Campervan culture westie springs on, with my panel van that should give me a 1.5inch lift.
What is the biggest setup I can get away with. 225-75-16 ?

If I can only do smaller then I'll just cruise at 65 (that's all I can do now) till I can build a box with a slip diff, locker and the right gearing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ob1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 16 at 21:18
I think that's too big. I might be wrong but I think you'll struggle at the front with that size.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bennythew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jan 16 at 16:23
Originally posted by ob1 ob1 wrote:

I think that's too big. I might be wrong but I think you'll struggle at the front with that size.



So what's the biggest wheel tire combo I can fit?

I'm happy to put lift springs on it if that helps?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bennythew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jan 16 at 09:22
This might not be the most exciting of swaps but I thought I'd document it anyway, plus if I have a thread going it might motivate me.

This is now sat on my drive.



I'm going to be running it as a daily until I'm ready to pull the engine.
This means I can start on my panel.



I'd rather not be doing this on my drive but the crewie is laid up in the garage and even if it wasn't, I think the panel is too big. I wouldn't get the garage door shut.

I've been doing tyre research. I've got an old set of 15 steelies that would take some BFG AT's, they would need spacing a little at et47 but it's a low cost option to get 215-75-15s on the van.
I'm also toying with larger sizes. At the rear I'd need less that factory offset to clear the trailing arm and I'd need to make sure I don't fowl the arches front and rear. I'm not greedy, but the larger I can go, the longer I'm likely to manage without regearing. Plus it looks rad.

I'm also planning on a mini resto while I'm at it. My bull bars will be going on, the running gear will be rebushed and repainted where needed, plus I'm also looking into bed liner coating my lower panels.

Sort of like this.





Mine will be black liner though, I think the contrast will look good against the masala red.

The next step is finding the parts, I'm converting from Ky so I lack many JX parts.
I'm in discussions with MV engineering at the moment about a full conversion parts package. Lots of new parts and a hybrid turbo eliminating the need for adaptors.
This might not be the cheapest way to do it but it will be quicker and the standard of parts will be high.
This also lets me sell my turbo, Ky engine and core exchange my golf loom to offset some of the expense.

If I go for the kit it will take a month or so to put together which gives me time to pull the Ky and do some work on the panel. I just need to borrow an engine crane from somewhere.

Right... that's me up to date.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bennythew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jan 16 at 21:08
The project has been on hold because I almost bought a Syncro.

I'd initially been looking at them when I wanted a T3 but had decided against it, for some reason though the hankering never really went away. I found myself trying to justify buying one as it would have higher value as a base vehicle and the off road capabilities are pretty impressive.

I was literally at the "get some cash out and go buy it" stage when I had a look at what I actually needed.

I want an off-road capable van that can smash in 500 mile days back to back at 40mpg.

A Syncro just adds weight, complexity and running costs. I might regret it but I passed in favour of building something epic.

Besides, unless I spent £15k plus, I wouldn't get a Syncro chassis that didn't need a ton of money thrown at it.

So...

Back to the proj...

Mario at MV engineering has put together a parts package. Pretty much every angle has been covered using new parts throughout.
I'm a fan of his approach, all the wear items are stock off the shelf parts. It's not the cheapest option, but nether is having a custom exhaust made every 3 years.
So I will be using both stock engine mounts, stock JX exhaust and a stock tdi clutch setup.

First things first the engine was removed from the panel.
My plan was to remove the Trans at the same time but one of the outer cv joint bolts has a stripped Allen head so I'm going to have to easyout it when I get one from work.






The engine came out pretty well, A few rusty fasteners and a bit of swearing but my buddy and I had it out in about 4 hours; we could most likely do the same job in an hour a second time.












The next step is going to be cleaning up the engine bay, seeing if any repairs need doing, painting the bay and preparing it to receive the new engine.

I will also be having the support bars powder coated along with my bull bars.

Edited by Bennythew - 30 Jan 16 at 09:35
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bennythew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Feb 16 at 21:04
Well I thought I'd give a bit of an update picture wise.

Things are a bit on hold as I've booked the van into a body shop to have some bits done in the engine bay and a bit of a refresh elsewhere. That's not till the first week of March so I've a couple of weeks.


Drastic measures needed to pull the box.







But I got there in the end.









Clean up time for the transferable parts.









After everything was degreased I started with a coat of etch primer in black. The gearbox was then epoxy primered in white but I forgot to photo that stage.



















The bell housing then came off for the input shaft swap. I've not got the tdi shaft yet but I wanted to make sure it came apart easily.









It might seen week one day one stuff to a lot of folk but I've done a kind of "how to" for anyone who is unsure.
I've read a lot about people using hybrid clutch set ups and this negates that.





The bell housing is just a matter of a few bolts and a rubber mallet to unseat it.



This is what you'll find inside, the shaft meets a collar and a circlip.







Just need to remove the clip from its notch and work it down the shaft (that what she said)







From there the collar will pull towards you and the shaft will screw out.











I then gave the bell housing a coat of the epoxy.





I wasn't fancy about it. Just a bush and one coat, making sure I had good coverage.

This stuff sets like stone and I use it in aircraft battery bays so it should last.

The box might lose some heat disapation but I'm hoping it won't ever be noticed.

So the last thing was an enamel topcoat cured by heat gun.

What ever smaller parts I end up doing in the same finish will get baked.





It looks the biz... for a knackered old gearbox anyway.


As you can see I mounted the bell housing; That was just for paint.
What I get delivered the shaft and seals I'll split it again and finish the job.

I'm still musing over ratios.

I want to split the box and put a taller 5th in it, but this box isn't my keeper, just what I'm going with till I can afford the box build I want. This case will be my spare.

So I'd want to do it myself. I'm happy building helicopter boxes but that in my comfort zone.


Anyone had any experience building boxes out side of a pro shop?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scimdiesel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Feb 16 at 09:37
Originally posted by Bennythew Bennythew wrote:

I'll call about the golf tomorrow, It's only 100 miles from me.

So... If I go this way... Shopping list?

-Fabricate an exhaust to fit using the golf manifold and my stock backbox.

-JX sump, ether new or recon (or weld a boss onto my Ky sump)

-Air intake? Reading required on this one. I'm assuming the golf inlet manifold is usable or will I need a JX intake?

-Wiring. Ether reloom it myself or pay someone to. Would the above car be immobilised via the Ecu? If so, how do you get around it?

-Mounting, only one mount to fab/buy if I'm correct?

-inter cooling and oil cooler to be researched.



ything else?


If you have access to a welder making the exhaust is easy enougth.  I added a flexy joint as this allows for some error.  Also reduces loads on the manifold etc.

Jx sump or KY sump...brickwerks do a bolt in adapter if welding porus cast aluminium is not your thing.

I used the Golf inlet manifold.    I used a JX air filter drum I fitted in the space behind the light.   Some flexi pope to house the airflow meter.   Other people use all the Golf stuff including the air filter housing but mount it in the near the battery on the offside.

You can strip out what you need for the golf loom and use the engine loom complete.   You also need the wires to the immobilizer which can either be in the clocks or or a box, then also the key and transducer.   If the immobilizer is in the clocks some folk put them behind the seats etc the neater option is to convert to the black box.   Contact SyncroAndy on here who can prepare your loom.  The other thing you want to retain is the ODB port as that allows you to look at fault codes etc.   Also you can use a Dongle and connect your phone to it and get live data.. Like water temp, intake temp etc.

near side engine mount you can buy.. I made mine not hard.    

Oil cooler generally not considered to be necessary.   Either my gauge is iffy or mine would heat the oil quite effectively. I still had a thermostatic setup and from mounted oil cooler off my AAZ  so I fitted that.

Intercooler.  Thats the fun bit.  People have these mounted everyware!.  Up the turret on the side of the van. Beside the gearbox with ducting,  or just with a wired fan.   Others have used water charge coolers      Mines a long thin one! under the van.  I think it was off a VW Sharan.  Theres loads of googling and hoses to buy!   
  

Without engineers science is just philosophy..... Joined the revolution with a 18 year old TDI :
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick1973 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Feb 16 at 11:13
you can de-immboiser the ecu too to save the hassle with keeping clocks etc
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